Hal, I was just playing as I suspect you were. Not being a hardcore follower but you were vaguely defending the concept.

I'm holding this idea to the same standard that we need to hold science too, and it doesn't hold up.

So, one tries to be fair, to put it in context. Consider the time line and the educational level of people thousands of years ago and try to understand what the need was that would create the concept and enforce it so rigorously. Understand the influence of nurture, environment, family traditions and if there is a genetic or biological component here and now.

Uniting a population under a supernatural being who can watch you or watch over you in 4000 BC must have been appealing. I have no argument with that. It is understandable into the Middle Ages to a degree, but if one looks carefully they will begin to see the books rewritten, the wealth concentrated and atrocious acts mount. A student of the belief theory could see the unrest, the fractured groups splitting off to carry-on or reinvent the theory to suit their new reality or need to maintain control.

What E.O. Wilson addresses is the unification of the Sciences. He brings the hard calculative science together with the soft social sciences in an attempt to demonstrate that both can work together…..IF.

It is one thing to calculate the distance to the moon and quite another to calculate how the mind was able to accomplish the calculation.

I'm not opposed to the premise of a theory that unites Minds and (for the purpose of this argument) Hearts but when the theory takes it's own course, or a life of it's own and interferes with the progress of man, then it needs to be examined. Under the microscope the theory of a Prime Mover doesn't do well, but that's not to say it did not have a practical application 6000 years ago.

I can understand that people have needs that I don't share, but if those needs interfere with my progress or our progress, they need to be isolated, defined and controlled. Not to put too fine a point on it, but we are at a time in our development when we need to put a limit on this dependency.

Knowing that the great powers of this society come from great wealth or large groups, limiting god is not going to be easy. Understanding the power of dependency will help our species curb the appetite of the portion of our population that depends on this concept for their security and purpose.

Every religion that I can find throughout history was replaced by another, I suspect that by combining the sciences that we can concoct a highbred theory that will inaccurately address some issues while exposing the needy population to fact based theory.


Originally Posted By: Hal Itosis
It seems like you're semi-serious and semi-kidding to get through this discussion. However, lately i can't tell which mode you're in (even within a sentence). So, i will cherry pick a small item and try to communicate in a normal fashion.

Originally Posted By: sandbox
Archeology unearths many examples that refute the 6000-year-old earth for example.

I believe you also mentioned earlier that the Earth was created in 7 days. Look, i'm no defender of *everything* in the Bible, and i'm no expert either... but it's certainly not a calculus book or a physics book, and sometimes it's not even a history book. I recall learning (and i'm not even sure it was from the Bible... that's how lame my "faith" is) this one equation: one day for God is a thousand years for man.

Do the math if you want, but my point is: lighten up. [you're directing a lot of anti-religious rhetoric at the wrong guy... i'm just open-minded.]


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Okay, one more thing.

>>> The Tao of Physics?
> I prefer Consilience

Apples and artichokes.

One (mine) fits this thread to a tee. I did that googley thing (on Sociobiology) and it seems a little too "Brave New World. . . on steroids" for me. If i have missed its merit, then perhaps it deserves a thread of its own [?].