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Explain this — PLEASE
#65010 11/19/23 12:07 AM
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SCENARIO

I have been experimenting with browsers and network security settings and suddenly found myself in an inexplicable situation when attempting to log on to FineTunedMac. When I clicked on Log In anywhere on FineTunedMac there would be an instantaneous screen blip and no login popup would appear in Arc, Bear, or Chrome, but Safari worked normally. I asked myself, "Why was Safari working but not the others?"

TROUBLESHOOTING
  • Since there had been a new release of the secure fork of Chrome I decided that may have been related but to my surprise, and frustration Firefox didn't work either.
  • I had installed several Chrome extensions in ARC so I disabled them and when that did not work uninstalled them — both to no avail.
  • I reset ARC's preferences to factory default — no joy
  • Since I had been trying different macOS network settings I reset all of those back — no change.
  • At this point I began trying every browser I could think of DuckDuckGo's private browser didn't work, but to my suprise, Tor browser and VPN did!. Then I noticed the Tor VPN was active.
  • Ah Hah says I, and turned my VPN (CyberGhost) ON.


Not only are all of the browsers logging on to FineTunedMac normally, but I have noticed that some annoying HTML font rendering issues have been resolved, in all of the browsers.

EXPLANATIONS SOUGHT:

  1. What was the problem?
  2. Was it only effecting FineTunedMac? (maybe it was only noticable on FTM?)
  3. Where was it originating?
  4. How is a VPN preventing the issue?
  5. Why wasn't Safari effected


confused


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65011 11/19/23 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
Why wasn't Safari effected confused
Private Relay?

Have you found any reports of others experiencing your issues?


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65013 11/19/23 12:42 AM
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Originally Posted by artie505
Private Relay?

I thought of that and among the settings changes and resets, I tested with private relay both off and on. No effect either way.

Originally Posted by artie505
Have you found any reports of others experiencing your issues?

No, but assuming the rendering issues are related to the failure of the log in HTML code, they are tenuous enough to go unnoticed. It could be related to the recent DDOS attack on FineTunedMac. (I wish I could replicate your shrugging shoulders stick figure, it would go so well here. smile


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65015 11/19/23 12:50 AM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
It could be related to the recent DDOS attack on FineTunedMac. (I wish I could replicate your shrugging shoulders stick figure, it would go so well here. smile
Is that why FTM was down the other day? Who'd even bother?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

You can copy, save somewhere, and paste it, same as I did.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65017 11/19/23 02:11 AM
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wink


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65018 11/19/23 02:37 AM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
wink
I don't get it!

Is the wink about the FTM DDOS or the "shrug?"


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65021 11/19/23 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by artie505
Have you found any reports of others experiencing your issues?
Originally Posted by joemikeb
No, but assuming the rendering issues are related…
My hand is raised as I had issues with FTM log-ins two or three times over the past few weeks but just waited and logged in some time after - like the next day. I didn’t think about it and chalked it up to a glitch that someone at FTM was probably working at.

I can’t contribute much more except that I am a Safari user and that’s the one browser that did not create an issue for joemike.

Last edited by ryck; 11/19/23 02:24 PM.

ryck

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iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2020), 3.8 GHz 8 Core Intel Core i7, 8GB RAM, 2667 MHz DDR4
OS Ventura 13.6.3
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Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65022 11/19/23 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by artie505
Originally Posted by joemikeb
wink
I don't get it!

Is the wink about the FTM DDOS or the "shrug?"

Yes, but obviously it wasn't obvious.


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
ryck #65023 11/19/23 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by ryck
[My hand is raised as I had issues with FTM log-ins two or three times over the past few weeks but just waited and logged in some time after - like the next day. I didn’t think about it and chalked it up to a glitch that someone at FTM was probably working at.

I can’t contribute much more except that I am a Safari user and that’s the one browser that did not create an issue for joemike.

Have you noticed any other subtle browser misbehavior on other sites such as font size, having to click more than once to trigger an action, failure to respond to keyboard input, more than normal typos, etc? I didn't really notice them until I turned VPN on and they are no longer happening.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I am dumping this in Apple's lap in hopes they can replicate what I am seeing and can figure out a fix. In the meantime, I am leaving VPN on.


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65025 11/19/23 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
Originally Posted by artie505
Originally Posted by joemikeb
wink
I don't get it!

Is the wink about the FTM DDOS or the "shrug?"

Yes, but obviously it wasn't obvious.
Typo! I think you meant to say "obliviously it wasn't obvious."


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65026 11/19/23 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
Have you noticed any other subtle browser misbehavior on other sites such as font size, having to click more than once to trigger an action, failure to respond to keyboard input, more than normal typos, etc? I didn't really notice them until I turned VPN on and they are no longer happening.
Nope....certainly nothing so obvious that I'd say: "That was weird, I wonder what that was about?", and I don't operate through a VPN.

Last edited by ryck; 11/19/23 09:27 PM.

ryck

"What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits" The Doobie Brothers

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2020), 3.8 GHz 8 Core Intel Core i7, 8GB RAM, 2667 MHz DDR4
OS Ventura 13.6.3
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner c/w VueScan software
TM on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
ryck #65124 11/23/23 05:17 PM
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shocked I hate it when a magic fix occurs, and I have no explanation. This morning I came in and verified my VPN was DISconnected opened Arc went to FineTunedMac and Arc automatically logged in with no problem. The same with Brave and Firefox. I cannot say there were no changes in my configuration as I have been doing a lot of tinkering this week but nothing that logically should have any impact on the FTM log in issue. confused confused confused

I am leaving the issue open with Apple and Arc. Hopefully, it will not magically reappear but if it does, my VPN work around is still available.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65130 11/23/23 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
shocked I hate it when a magic fix occurs, and I have no explanation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Haha....I take the approach that sometimes you just have to scratch your head and keep on going.

Last edited by ryck; 11/23/23 07:11 PM.

ryck

"What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits" The Doobie Brothers

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2020), 3.8 GHz 8 Core Intel Core i7, 8GB RAM, 2667 MHz DDR4
OS Ventura 13.6.3
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner c/w VueScan software
TM on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
ryck #65131 11/23/23 07:19 PM
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Some are lucky enough to be able to go that route, and others - such as yours truly - lie awake in bed and lose sleep over such occurrences.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65135 11/23/23 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ryck
Haha....I take the approach that sometimes you just have to scratch your head and keep on going.

Originally Posted by artie505
Some are lucky enough to be able to go that route, and others - such as yours truly - lie awake in bed and lose sleep over such occurrences.

Many years ago, I learned the value of solving a problem was often secondary to, the value of what was learned in the process of solving it. While I may not like the unanswered question, it forced me to dig back into technologies I had not kept abreast of and to take a fresh look at the network security settings I had been using for years. I found a number of changes in the technology and OS I had missed, re-examined my options both at home and on the road for each of my devices. Made changes to the Mac Studio, iPhone, and iPad Pro, eliminated some no longer needed or outdated apps and utilities and optimized settings in others.

While I may not have discovered the specific cause of my issue, I feel the troubleshooting process was well worth the effort. If I have any trouble sleeping, it will be because of all the new thoughts and ideas, not because of any lack of solution.


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
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Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65137 11/23/23 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by joemikeb
While I may not have discovered the specific cause of my issue, I feel the troubleshooting process was well worth the effort.
Indeed!

Originally Posted by joemikeb
If I have any trouble sleeping, it will be because of all the new thoughts and ideas, not because of any lack of solution.
Easy to say now that the problem has passed. wink


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65274 12/08/23 10:47 PM
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IT'S BACK????

Not exactly the original issue with FineTunedMac, this time it is a personal website I am putting together.
  1. Every attempt to access the site from my computer was timing out, regardless of the browser.
  2. No problem using my iPad or iPhone logged onto the same Wi-Fi network
  3. No problem accessing FTM on any device
  4. Switch on VPN Site Works
  5. Based on artie's question, "Private Relay?" turn Private Relay ON? Site Works
  6. Careful checking indicates all devices have identical network configurations


WHAT AM I MISSING???? confused


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65275 12/08/23 11:18 PM
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Did you swing the chicken around your head clockwise or counterclockwise? tongue

How strange that VPN and Private Relay are working opposite from how they might be expected to work and also that your original problem has migrated from a mysteriously uncompromised location to a new location.

'Tis a puzzlement!


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
artie505 #65276 12/08/23 11:59 PM
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I'm sorry to intrude, but one must always swing the chicken counter-clockwise.


iMac (19,1, 3.1 GHz i5, 12.7.2, 40 Gb RAM) with Mac Pro (5,1, dual-2.4 GHz, 10.13.6, 24 Gb RAM) used as a server and to run 32-bit apps via Screen Sharing. MacBook Air (1.8 Ghz, 8 Gb RAM, 10.14.6, 256 Gb SSD) Vodafone router and Devolo Wi-Fi Extender, Canon TS8351 printer/scanner.
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
freelance #65279 12/10/23 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by freelance
I'm sorry to intrude, but one must always swing the chicken counter-clockwise.

laugh ROFL laugh


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Explain this — PLEASE
joemikeb #65281 12/10/23 04:11 PM
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UPDATE

Still no solution. There are indications the problem may be originating in my router but, since the other devices are going through the same router, why is my Mac the only one effected? As I have viable workarounds, I am putting the solution to this conundrum into a background task and continuing with my real work in the foreground.

Last edited by joemikeb; 12/10/23 04:17 PM. Reason: Reword

If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein

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