An open community 
of Macintosh users,
for Macintosh users.

FineTunedMac Dashboard widget now available! Download Here

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Cookie problems anyone?
#62736 10/30/22 11:59 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
For the past few months, my FTM cookies (MacUpdate, eBay, and maybe, but I can't be certain, others too) have been "disappearing" before their scheduled expiration date.

These cookies disappeared last night.

It's beyond annoying!

Is anyone else experiencing the same thing?

I suppose this may be a Safari issue, so mods, please move this if it belongs elsewhere.

More: The cookies aren't expiring early and being renewed. I'm being forced to log in anew each time it happens.

Last edited by cyn; 10/31/22 10:17 AM. Reason: Topic moved from FineTunedMac Feedback to Networking

The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62738 10/30/22 07:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
I ran into a spate of that happening a month or so back and only on the Mac, neither the IPhone or iPad appear to have encountered a similar problem. I have not encountered the issue for a while, but I have since updated to macOS 13.1 and changed my default browser from Safari to Safari Technology Preview, so I have no definitive clue to the cause. As a suggestion, you might try [ur==https://developer.apple.com/safari/technology-preview/]safari Technology Preview[/url] and see if the problem goes away.


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62742 10/31/22 01:44 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Alternatively, having reread Jon's linked article and not been made as apprehensive about Ventura as I was the first time I read it, I may just upgrade and see how it goes.

In case I either now or eventually move to Safari Technology Preview, though, will you please explain how to go about setting things up in iCloud so I can share bookmarks et. al. between Safari and STP.

Thanks.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62747 10/31/22 01:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
There is nothing to setup. STP and Safari use the same settings files, etc.

Do you remember to check the Remember Me box when you log in?


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62749 10/31/22 07:04 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Thanks, but I decided to upgrade to Ventura rather than experiment with STP. Fingers crossed!

As an aside, how does your response jive with
Surf seamlessly with iCloud. Safari Technology Preview works with iCloud, so you can access your latest Safari Favorites, bookmarks, and Reading List.
Wouldn't I first have to check both Safari and STP in System Settings > Internet Accounts > iCloud?


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62750 10/31/22 10:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by artie505
As an aside, how does your response jive with
Surf seamlessly with iCloud. Safari Technology Preview works with iCloud, so you can access your latest Safari Favorites, bookmarks, and Reading List.
Wouldn't I first have to check both Safari and STP in System Settings > Internet Accounts > iCloud?

  1. Safari and Safari Technology Preview use the same preference file(s), cookies, extensions, bookmarks, autofill data, password database, etc.
  2. The only difference between the two is the actual executable, which includes the version of WebKit *¹ *².
  3. There is no provision in Settings > Apple ID > iCloud for Safari Technology Preview *³
  4. iCloud only gets involved when the settings are shared between different devices. This enables Safari & Safari Technology preview on my Mac to share the same settings, bookmarks, autofill data, and password data with Safari on my iPhone and iPad.
  5. Cookies and extensions are unique to each device, regardless of what is checked in Settings > Apple ID > iCloud.


_____________________

  1. NOTE: several apple and third-party apps, including Mail, share the version of WebKit in Safari on macOS.
  2. All browsers on iOS & iPadOS, including Brave, Chrome, and Firefox use the WebKit in Safari.
  3. There is no version of Safari Technology Preview for either iOS or iPadOS


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62751 11/01/22 08:52 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
Originally Posted by artie505
As an aside, how does your response jive with
Surf seamlessly with iCloud. Safari Technology Preview works with iCloud, so you can access your latest Safari Favorites, bookmarks, and Reading List.
Wouldn't I first have to check both Safari and STP in System Settings > Internet Accounts > iCloud?
<snip>

In short, then, Apple should have said
Surf seamlessly with iCloud. Safari Technology Preview works with iCloud, so you can access your latest Safari Favorites, bookmarks, and Reading List on all your devices. (Red text added)


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62753 11/01/22 12:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by artie505
Originally Posted by joemikeb
In short, then, Apple should have said [quote:Safari Technology Preview - Safari - Apple Developer]Surf seamlessly with iCloud. Safari Technology Preview works with iCloud, so you can access your latest Safari Favorites, bookmarks, and Reading List on all your devices. (Red text added)

Which could imply Software Technology Preview is available on “all your devices”, which is a falsehood. Pwersonally I would have left any reference to ICloud out. It is not as if Safari Technology Preview has any more abilities in that regard than Safari does. I suspect that is a result of some overly-enthusiastic marketing speak.


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62754 11/01/22 04:10 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
  • Cookies and extensions are unique to each device, regardless of what is checked in Settings > Apple ID > iCloud.

I just realized that assertion may not be 100% true. If I am logged onto a website on my iPhone and bring it near my Mac, the Safari, or Safari Technology Preview, the icon on the Mac's Dock changes and I can transfer the iPhone's connection including the site logon to the Mac, simply by clicking on the modified icon. That also includes data stored in cookies. I assume the cookies are synched between the devices via Bluetooth(?), but I have no idea if they are physically copied or read remotely on the other device. I do know the two logons remain synchronized.


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62756 11/02/22 10:53 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
No luck upgrading, nor did I have much hope, because Ventura and Monterey run the same version of Safari.

I guess I'll try STP.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62758 11/02/22 11:27 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
  1. Safari and Safari Technology Preview use the same preference file(s), cookies, extensions, bookmarks, autofill data, password database, etc.
  2. The only difference between the two is the actual executable, which includes the version of WebKit *¹ *².
I installed STP, and although it has found my extensions and password database, it is not finding my cookies or bookmarks.

I hope there's a setting I've missed, because while my cookies will grow back on their own, I've got absolutely no inclination to replicate my bookmarks.

Rats! Although STP has found my extensions and password database, It has not found my cookies or bookmarks.

The cookies are no big deal, because they'll grow back eventually, but I"ve got absolutely no inclination to replicate my bookmarks.

I tried replacing STP's bookmarks plist with Safari's - shut down and restarted for good measure - but no luck....DEAL BREAKER! frown

Does Safari Beta sound like a viable alternative?


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62759 11/02/22 11:33 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
I have no idea why Safari Technology Preview has not picked up your bookmarks. I just searched my system using FindAnyFile and I only have one set of bookmarks for Safari and there are no separate bookmarks for Safari Technology Preview confused

Safari Technology Preview is in a sense a Beta, but a bit more than that. It is used to try out potential browser features to see if they are worth developing and including in a future release of the OS and Safari. The actual Safari beta is only available as part of the OS beta. (Yes, there are links to a Safari beta, but they end up re-directing to Safari Technology Preview). Safari beta issues are reported through the macOS, iOS, or iPadOS Feedback Assistant that is installed as part of the beta OS, while Safari Technology Preview Feedback is a separate system accessed from the STP Help menu.


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62762 11/03/22 03:29 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
I have no idea why Safari Technology Preview has not picked up your bookmarks. I just searched my system using FindAnyFile and I only have one set of bookmarks for Safari and there are no separate bookmarks for Safari Technology Preview confused
I've got ~/Library/Safari/Bookmarks.plist, and I had ~/Library/STP/Bookmarks.plist, and as I said, even after I trashed the latter, replaced it with the former, and did a cold start, STP still reported the same bookmarks as were in the trashed file. confused confused


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62764 11/03/22 06:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by artie505
I've got ~/Library/Safari/Bookmarks.plist, and I had ~/Library/STP/Bookmarks.plist, and as I said, even after I trashed the latter, replaced it with the former, and did a cold start, STP still reported the same bookmarks as were in the trashed file. confused confused

I have the ~/Library/Safari/Bookmarks.plist that contains all my bookmarks, but I do not have the corresponding file in ~/Library/SafariTechnologyPreview/ which is what I expected, but that doesn't explain why you have the Bookmarks.plist in both folders and I don't. To be truthul, I have used SafariTechnologyPreview off and on for years and I may have performed some step that I have long since forgotten. You might try copying the Bookmarks.plist from ~/Library/Safari to ~/Library/SafariTechnologyPreview and see if the full set of bookmarks shows up in STP. confused

When you trashed the Bookmarks.plist, did you also delete ~/Library/Saved Application State/com.apple.SafariTechnologyPreview.savedstate? That might account for the restored bookmarks.


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62766 11/03/22 08:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
I had trashed STP after moving in ~/Library/Safari/Bookmarks.plist didn't help, so I reinstalled it, and again didn't have my bookmarks or cookies. (STP didn't pick up my prefs either, but I'm not sure if it's supposed to.)

So before doing anything else, I took a look and found that ~/Library/STP/Bookmarks.plist didn't exist but ~/Library/STP/TopSites.plist did, so I moved it to the side, moved in ~/Library/Safari/Bookmarks.plist, and VOILA! (The ~/Library/STP/Bookmarks.plist I originally reported having was apparently created by me when I bookmarked FTM.)

At any rate, I've now got a usable version of STP, albeit sans cookies, which I'll recreate as I go along, and hopefully they won't disappear.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62767 11/03/22 10:51 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by artie505
I had trashed STP after moving in ~/Library/Safari/Bookmarks.plist didn't help, so I reinstalled it, and again didn't have my bookmarks or cookies. (STP didn't pick up my prefs either, but I'm not sure if it's supposed to.)

confused confused confused Then why don’t I have separate files for SAFARI & STP, but I have the identical bookmarks in each and if I edit a bookmark in one the change appears in the other?? I would suspect it was because of the iCloud connection, but the bookmarks don’t go away when I din’t have an internet connection. confused confused confused

I am still missing something, but what???


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62768 11/04/22 10:32 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
...I have the identical bookmarks in each and if I edit a bookmark in one the change appears in the other??
That is not the case with my installation.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62770 11/05/22 08:30 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
I am still missing something, but what???
Nothing more than an explanation, or perhaps just an insight, apparently.

I checked the Safari box in Apps/System Settings > AppleIDPrefPane > iCloud, and my Safari and STP bookmarks synchronized with no further ado.

I then turned off my Internet, and the two sets of bookmarks remained in sync when I added/deleted a new bookmark.

Ha! So it turns out that
Surf seamlessly with iCloud. Safari Technology Preview works with iCloud, so you can access your latest Safari Favorites, bookmarks, and Reading List.
is on the mark, but exceptionally poorly presented.

My cookies haven't synchronized, but that's in keeping with the quote.

Case closed...except for some residual head scratching.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62797 11/11/22 02:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Getting all the way back to my OP, my cookies are still disappearing...now in the latest version of Safari Technology Preview. (The status was quo in the latest version of Safari last time I looked.)


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62800 11/11/22 10:24 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Your situation appears to be relatively unique. Have you tried turning all Safari extensions off? Didn't you used to run the Cookies application? Could there still be remanants hanging around?


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
joemikeb #62801 11/12/22 05:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by joemikeb
Your situation appears to be relatively unique. Have you tried turning all Safari extensions off? Didn't you used to run the Cookies application? Could there still be remanants hanging around?
The only extensions I'm running are Roadblock and Wipr, neither of which should have anything to do with cookies.

I'm still running Cookie, but I've asked its dev about the issue a couple of times and haven't received a response, nor have any of his updates addressed it. I've now disabled Cookie to see if it accomplishes anything. (ryck is also running Cookie, and he apparently hasn't had any problems.)

The curious thing about this is that not all of my cookies disappear...only the ones that affect login.

Ah ha! I just focused and realized that it's the "Remember Me" cookies that are disappearing. (MacUpdate doesn't present me with the option, although it does remember me.)

Any thoughts on that?


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62802 11/12/22 06:54 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Moderator
Offline
Moderator

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
I will be interested to know if there is any change in behavior since you deactivated Cookie. I would posit that the “Remember Me” cookies are simply the ones you are aware of disappearing because they are the most obvious. There could easily be any number of cookies being deleted and later being recreated, unless you actively audit all of your cookies at the beginning and ending of each on-line session. It is easy enough to deactivate and activate Safari Extensions, that even though neither Roadblock or WIPR should have any effect, it might be worth deactivating them, one at a time, to see if either has any effect.


"Sacred cows make the best hamburger"

- Mark Twain
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
artie505 #62805 11/13/22 12:44 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 6
Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 6
Originally Posted by artie505
[quote=joemikeb]ryck is also running Cookie, and he apparently hasn't had any problems.
You're correct on both counts....no issues here.

Last edited by ryck; 11/13/22 12:48 AM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Cookie problems anyone?
ryck #62806 11/13/22 02:32 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
OP Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by ryck
Originally Posted by artie505
[quote=joemikeb]ryck is also running Cookie, and he apparently hasn't had any problems.
You're correct on both counts....no issues here.
It may be because you're running a "legacy" version of the OS, and my problems began in Monterey.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

Moderated by  alternaut, dianne, MacManiac 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4
(Release build 20200307)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.4.25 Page Time: 0.030s Queries: 62 (0.019s) Memory: 0.7057 MB (Peak: 0.8716 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2022-11-29 08:36:26 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS