An open community 
of Macintosh users,
for Macintosh users.

FineTunedMac Dashboard widget now available! Download Here

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Starting from scratch, older iMac
#60623 01/19/22 03:21 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
The following excerpts are from a previous thread Keyboard audio volume keys not working but, as that thread evolved into a whole different topic I’m starting one better titled for the evolved topic.
Originally Posted by joemikeb
The quickest, most reliable, solution would be nuke & pave from a Bootable Thumb Drive installer or external boot drive. Under the circumstances I would be wary of using a Recovery Drive installer in case it too had been somehow compromised.
Originally Posted by joemikeb
To go backwards from the currently installed version you must completely erase the drive first, which can only be done from another computer, a bootable thumb drive installer, or bootable external drive.
Originally Posted by joemikeb
The bootable thumb drive has the advantage that it boots only a minute subset of macOS, just enough to run DU and the installer, which eliminates version conflicts.
Okay….so now I’m going with the above advice. With the audio transfer tool recommended by artie, I have no need for the 21” iMac so I would like to clean it completely and have my daughter take it home for the grandchildren to use.

The machine is:

21” iMac, early 2008.
2.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4 GB of RAM

The goal: Installing the most current system the machine will handle, with the least fuss. I am just ordering a thumb drive, so no rush on the response, but I will need to know what to put on the thumb drive, where to find it, and how to load it onto the thumb drive...... and any other wise counsel.

Last edited by ryck; 01/19/22 03:26 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60624 01/19/22 06:03 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
According to Mactracker, your 20" Early 2008 iMac maxes out at OS X 10.11 El Cap.

You can d/l El Cap by simply clicking on the link on this page, although if the iMac is running OS X 10.7 Lion or later, I think you can do the entire job, including erasing its HDD/SSD in Recovery mode.

Hope that helps.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60626 01/19/22 10:07 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by artie505
According to Mactracker, your 20" Early 2008 iMac maxes out at OS X 10.11 El Cap.
Before I had the issues described in the other thread (unable to get it past Snow Leopard 10.6.8) the machine had been running 10.11.6. Okay, good to know that’s where I max out.

Originally Posted by artie505
….if the iMac is running OS X 10.7 Lion or later, I think you can do the entire job, including erasing its HDD/SSD in Recovery mode.
Since that won’t be the process for me (currently 10.6.8), I assume I just poke the thumb drive, containing the El Capitan download, into a USB port and start the machine with the Option button pressed. Then I should be able to select the thumb drive and it will take care of erasing the drive and installing the system. Yes?

Last edited by ryck; 01/19/22 10:09 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60627 01/19/22 10:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by ryck
Originally Posted by artie505
….if the iMac is running OS X 10.7 Lion or later, I think you can do the entire job, including erasing its HDD/SSD in Recovery mode.
Since that won’t be the process for me (currently 10.6.8), I assume I just poke the thumb drive, containing the El Capitan download, into a USB port and start the machine with the Option button pressed. Then I should be able to select the thumb drive and it will take care of erasing the drive and installing the system. Yes?
No... The El Cap d/l won't be bootable, so you'll have to plug in the thumb drive and double click on its icon to launch the installer, which will not erase the HDD/SSD.

You can make a bootable installer, but I'm not up on the details.

I'm not sure, though, that you can upgrade Snowy to El Cap without a pit stop in !0.7. Didn't you have a problem earlier? (More: Looks like you can.)

Personally, I'd really prefer to see the iMac's HDD/SSD wiped (in FireWire target disk mode), but unless you can get into Recovery, you'll need an adaptor (this one, I think) to do it.

More: I just took a look, and you may actually be able to upgrade to El Cap via Software Update. cool ... maybe

Last edited by artie505; 01/19/22 10:54 PM. Reason: More & More

The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60629 01/20/22 09:16 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by artie505
You can make a bootable installer, but I'm not up on the details.
The instructions appear to be here.


ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60630 01/20/22 10:18 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Looks like it.

Please refresh my memory. Didn't you report in another thread that you were unable upgrade Snowy to El Cap on the iMac in question? And if so, I wonder if you'll be any more successful with the bootable installer?

Fingers crossed.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60632 01/20/22 03:31 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by artie505
Didn't you report in another thread that you were unable upgrade Snowy to El Cap on the iMac in question? And if so, I wonder if you'll be any more successful with the bootable installer?
That's correct....for both El Capitan and Yosemite. In both cases, after the install process, the dialogue box said: "Installation Successful" and yet the system was still Snow Leopard.

In the recommendations to use a thumb drive, among the reasons from joemike, were:
Originally Posted by joemikeb
The quickest, most reliable, solution would be nuke & pave from a Bootable Thumb Drive installer or external boot drive. Under the circumstances I would be wary of using a Recovery Drive installer in case it too had been somehow compromised.
Originally Posted by joemikeb
The bootable thumb drive has the advantage that it boots only a minute subset of macOS, just enough to run DU and the installer, which eliminates version conflicts.

Last edited by ryck; 01/20/22 03:34 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60633 01/20/22 03:36 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
As I said: Fingers crossed.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60641 01/21/22 01:26 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Almost there but still no cigar. I got through the entire process until the spot where I enter ‘y’ in Terminal to erase the thumb drive. Instead of erasure I got an error message: “Failed to start erase of disk due to error (-9999-0)”

I found a list of main causes for error messages and one of them was “Incompatible or outdated software/hardware installed on the machine.” Hmmmm. Could it be the thumb drive? I didn’t give it any thought when I purchased, so the drive is USB 3 whereas the old Mac would be USB 2


ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60644 01/21/22 09:09 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by ryck
Could it be the thumb drive? I didn’t give it any thought when I purchased, so the drive is USB 3 whereas the old Mac would be USB 2
USB 3 shouldn't matter, because it's backwards compatible with USB 2, i.e. it'll work, but with USB 2 limitations.

As long as you're working with at least a 14 GB (as per Apple) thumb drive, I'm not aware of any reasons why you should be having problems. But then again, I've never been through the process and am not aware of its possible nuances.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60647 01/21/22 03:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by artie505
As long as you're working with at least a 14 GB (as per Apple) thumb drive, I'm not aware of any reasons why you should be having problems.
It's 64GB. Maybe there's another way to make a bootable thumb drive.


ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60648 01/21/22 05:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 3
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 3
Check out Install Disk Creator. I have used it in the distant past and it is easy and seamless. The linked page provided also lists other methods to create a bootable thumb drive.


On a Mac since 1984.
Currently: 27" iMacs, Macbook Air, macOS 10.15.x,; iPhones, iPods and iPads galore!
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
Ira L #60656 01/22/22 03:17 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Thanks for that....it looks like a helpful piece of software....if I can get to use it. I've run into a more basic issue: I am unable to get the material I need while on the 20" iMac. Safari will not link to the download sites, instead saying that it cannot make a secure connection. In fact, there are very few sites that Safari (V4.0.3) will connect to on that machine. ?? Thinking there might be a broken bit in Safari, I reinstalled Snow Leopard, but nada. I then rebuilt the directory with Disk Warrior, but nada.

I tried to make the bootable thumb drive on my 27" iMac, but I get a dialogue box that says that this version of the OS cannot be installed on this machine. Since it appears the bootable thumb drive can only be made on the machine it's to be used for, I am wondering if I should burn the OS and Disk Creator to a disk and use it to install them on the 20".

I have the original install discs for the machine but am not anxious to go back through that process again, as it didn't generate any positive results the first time I tried it.

Last edited by ryck; 01/22/22 03:20 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60659 01/22/22 06:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
1. Have you looked at Software Update on the 20" iMac to see if it offers you anything helpful?

2. Even if you d/l Install Disk Creator to your 27" iMac and transfer it to the 20" on a CD, I wonder if the available version will run in such an old version of the OS?

3. I've kinda lost track of what's been going on, so this may be a dumb question, but have you tried d/l'ing El Cap to the 20"er via the link on https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372 (How to create a bootable installer for macOS) and running the included installer, or have you just been trying regular stand-alone installers?

4. This is one of those instances in which I'd love to have the Mac under discussion on my desk in front of me!


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60660 01/22/22 07:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by artie505
1. Have you looked at Software Update on the 20" iMac to see if it offers you anything helpful?
Yes...have done that this morning and went through two updates so that Safari is now 5.1.10 and it connects to various sites without issue.

Originally Posted by artie505
I've kinda lost track of what's been going on, so this may be a dumb question, but have you tried d/l'ing El Cap to the 20"er via the link on https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372 (How to create a bootable installer for macOS) and running the included installer, or have you just been trying regular stand-alone installers?
Yes, again....and, in fact, am currently in the midst of it. However, the download doesn't appear to want to stop. So far it's at 8.02 of 5.78 GB.....and still going.

Update: Gave up on the download and stopped it. I've cleared the Download list and have started afresh.

Last edited by ryck; 01/22/22 07:10 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60661 01/22/22 07:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by ryck
Update: Gave up on the download and stopped it. I've cleared the Download list and have started afresh.
Well, I got the right download et cetera but, as previously, at the point where I enter ‘y’ in Terminal to erase the thumb drive, I get an error message: “Failed to start erase of disk due to error (-9999-0)”

Last edited by ryck; 01/22/22 07:47 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60662 01/22/22 07:51 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by ryck
Originally Posted by artie505
1. Have you looked at Software Update on the 20" iMac to see if it offers you anything helpful?
Yes...have done that this morning and went through two updates so that Safari is now 5.1.10 and it connects to various sites without issue.
But it doesn't offer you an OS upgrade?

Brain( tongue )storm: In your other thread, you reported that you remain at Snowy even though you've run upgrade installers, and I'm wondering if SU is "mum" on upgrades because it thinks you're already up to date?

I've got a file, /Library/Receipts/InstallHistory.plist, in which a record of all installers I've run is maintained, and you should have an identical or equivalent file in Snowy. I wonder if SU will refresh itself if you open that file and delete every reference to the upgrades you've run, and then restart?

i dunno...worth a try.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60663 01/22/22 07:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by ryck
Originally Posted by ryck
Update: Gave up on the download and stopped it. I've cleared the Download list and have started afresh.
Well, I got the right download et cetera but, as previously, at the point where I enter ‘y’ in Terminal to erase the thumb drive, I get an error message: “Failed to start erase of disk due to error (-9999-0)”
Have you tried to simply run the included installer to see if it will upgrade you from Snowy (without erasing your drive)?


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60664 01/23/22 01:58 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Yes....tried that twice in the other thread - once with Yosemite and once with El Capitan. Each time the dialogue box advised "Installation was successful" and each time there was no change. The OS remained as Snow Leopard.


ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60665 01/23/22 03:11 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
I knew you had tried, but I wasn't sure which incarnation of the installer you tried with. I was wondering if you tried with the version you d/l'ed to create the bootable installer...not that I really think any particular installer will work differently than others, but because at this point, anything you can try is worth a try.

I'm not aware of any reason why Software Update isn't offering you an upgrade other than because it thinks you're running El Cap already, so I think trying the fix I suggested is certainly worth the effort. (Be certain to erase EVERY reference to any version of the OS beyond Snowy.)


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60666 01/23/22 05:40 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Out of curiosity, what does /System/Library/CoreServices/SystemVersion tell you?


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60667 01/23/22 10:56 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
And if you'd like to cut straight to the chase, here's what may be your ultimate solution:
  1. Erase your OTG Pro.
  2. Clone Snowy from the iMac to the OTG.
  3. Boot the iMac from the clone.
  4. Erase the iMac with Disk Utility.
  5. Install El Cap on the erased disk.

And if that doesn't work, Lt. Columbo is out of pesty ideas. tongue
But I still suggest trying to tweak Software Update.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60668 01/23/22 01:04 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Or if you prefer, you can install El Cap on the erased OTG rather than cloning Snowy.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
artie505 #60669 01/23/22 06:03 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
ryck Offline OP
OP Offline

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Originally Posted by artie505
....at this point, anything you can try is worth a try.
Given I had reinstalled Snow Leopard, and it went through a couple of updates, I thought I'd once more try upgrading....so I ran the previously downloaded Yosemite installer. After about forty minutes I got a mountain on the screen and an "About this Mac" that says Yosemite 10.10.5. Curiously, I tried to get updates from the web (as I did with Snow Leopard) but the machine said: "Cannot connect to the App Store".

The end goal is to give the machine to my grandchildren so I still need to get to a bootable thumb drive with El Capitan and, figuring the machine should be as up to date as possible, I am now running the El Capitan installer.

Gigantic Irony: This all started in the previous thread because the audio function keys (F10, F11, F12) were not working. After the current Yosemite install, they were still not working so, after a short bit of head-scratching, I swapped keyboards with the 27" keyboard. You guessed it....the function keys worked. Aaaargh!!

Last edited by ryck; 01/23/22 06:26 PM.

ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
OS Mojave 10.14.6
Canon Pixma TR 8520 Printer
Epson Perfection V500 Photo Scanner
Time Machine on 1TB LaCie USB-C
Carbon Copy Clone on 500GB OWC Mercury OTG Pro
Re: Starting from scratch, older iMac
ryck #60673 01/24/22 09:36 AM
Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
Online

Joined: Aug 2009
Likes: 5
I think you can now forget about the bootable installer.

Since you're running Yosemite, you can boot into Recovery, where you'll have access to Disk Utility to erase your HDD/SSD, and to the various install options, one of which will be the most up to date OS your iMac can run, i.e. El Cap.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204904 How to reinstall macOS - Apple Support

WOW! What an ordeal, particularly when you factor in the irony.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  alternaut, dkmarsh, joemikeb 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4
(Release build 20200307)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.4.25 Page Time: 0.139s Queries: 65 (0.113s) Memory: 0.8502 MB (Peak: 1.6920 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2022-05-25 00:39:54 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS