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#5148 - 10/19/09 02:54 PM Re: Unexplained Lounge-Behavior Principles [Re: sandbox]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Originally Posted By: sandbox
Apparently your idea of science is something unique to you. There are many disciplines but for some reason your trying to impose your definition on others. Curious?

Impose? No, we are having a debate about whether or not 'faith' plays any role in science. And it's hardly my *unique* viewpoint when page 6 linked to a New York Times article by Paul Davies. One plus one equals two? Therefore, not unique? Got it yet?


Originally Posted By: sandbox
My posts as they relate to you and Catholicism are based on your annual visits to these establishments. I suspected that by using examples of the tradition that you understood, that you would be able to get over yourself, but I see that I've not been successful.

I told you many pages ago you were talking to the wrong guy. If i choose to play the devil's advocate with respect to science, it's to determine what exactly the "scientific" knowledge level is in here. So far, you get an F- (mainly for clinging on to your anti-religious beliefs, rather than intelligently discussing unexplained scientific principles). If i choose to join my old Dad (who has Alzheimer's) on Christmas and Easter, that my business... and you'd do well to stay the f&*( out of it.


Edited by Hal Itosis (10/19/09 03:23 PM)

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#5149 - 10/19/09 03:46 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: Hal Itosis]
sandbox Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Water World
Quote:
"The guy" (in case someone didn't know) was one of the greatest physicists of our time.


I'm well aware of who he was and his place in history. Was he not a guy? I wasn't being disrespectful, was I? The next time I address him I'll be genuflecting.

You can pretend to be a "scientist" and I'll continue to examine how a scientist justifies their unsubstantiated faith in superman in a thread that you would like to be about physics now, while arguing for the right to your religious beliefs.

It was you who started with the name calling (sandbag) and then whining about me attacking your right to defend religion in a scientific thread. I'm the juvenile, and I'm unscientific because I will not concede to your notion that god and scientific inquiry can coexist in a thread, school or mind without contradiction.

If you apply the same rigorous qualification to your faith, as you would expect in scientific inquiry you would come to see my position. If you examine where unchecked faith has drifted through the years you will understand how detrimental faith based assumptions have been on our species. Time and brainpower is being wasted on satisfying people fears and needs. As I mentioned earlier just imagine the trillions of hours lost looking for superman, and creating new supermen with all their contradictions and desires to engineer societies through the millennium.

Enjoy life ------ it has an expiration date! wink


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#5150 - 10/19/09 04:09 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: sandbox]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Oh well...apparently, any earnest discussion of 'unexplained scientific principles' will *not* be taking place after all.

Originally Posted By: sandbag
You can pretend to be a "scientist" and I'll continue to examine how a scientist justifies their unsubstantiated faith in superman in a thread that you would like to be about physics now, while arguing for the right to your religious beliefs.

Petty tyrannical nonsense.


Originally Posted By: sandbag
I'm the juvenile, and I'm unscientific because I will not concede to your notion that god and scientific inquiry can coexist in a thread, school or mind without contradiction.

Concede? You're the one who keeps bringing up religion. As i said a dozen times: believe what you want. Let me augment that: i don't care what you believe.

I guess they rode you pretty hard in that catholic school, huh?  My condolences.


Originally Posted By: sandbag
If you apply the same rigorous qualification to your faith, as you would expect in scientific inquiry you would come to see my position.

What faith???... i already told you i was agnostic. Look up the word dude, and learn something for a change. It's you -- the atheist -- who's the one with faith... because you *believe* there is no God, despite the lack of any conclusive proof one way or the other.


Originally Posted By: sandbag
Time and brainpower is being wasted on satisfying people fears and needs. As I mentioned earlier just imagine the trillions of hours lost looking for superman, and creating new supermen with all their contradictions and desires to engineer societies through the millennium.


Oh shut up. grin    If you want to talk about "time", try filling in the blanks in my last post to alternaut (where did s/he go?):

Complete the following sentence (using as many words as necessary):
In the 1800s, science __________ Newton's concept of time... based on __________ .





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#5151 - 10/19/09 04:24 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: Hal Itosis]
cyn Online

Administrator

Registered: 08/03/09
Time for folks to take a break from this thread. When I reopen it in a day or two, at the very least you all need to show each other enough respect to lay off the username games.


Edited by cyn (10/21/09 08:53 PM)
Edit Reason: Thread reopened.
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#5220 - 10/22/09 05:23 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: cyn]
crarko Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Minnesota USA
The Physical Revue

(by Tom Lehrer)
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The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth. - Niels Bohr

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#5224 - 10/22/09 10:46 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: crarko]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Cool!!! cool

I've loved Tom Lehrer for maaany years...even knew his brother and nephews back in my Boy Scout days, but I wasn't aware of "The Physical Review."

Thanks for the link.
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#5231 - 10/23/09 04:55 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: artie505]
crarko Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Minnesota USA
Sure. smile

And now, hotly debated science in a realm much closer to home than quantum gravity; a letter sent to members of the U.S. Senate on the subject of climate change.

My feeling on the subject has always been that I'm way less interested in looking for someone to blame, and more in trying to work a solution to the problem, if possible.
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The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth. - Niels Bohr

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#5238 - 10/23/09 09:22 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: crarko]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: crarko
Sure. :)My feeling on the subject has always been that I'm way less interested in looking for someone to blame, and more in trying to work a solution to the problem, if possible.


I'm with you. The first isn't going to accomplish much but we owe the second to our children and grandchildren.

ryck
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#5252 - 10/23/09 04:31 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: crarko]
dkmarsh Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09

I think the blame often comes in at the point at which highly influential parties decline to participate in the devising of any solutions contrary to their unilateral good fortunes.

Hence, for example, the U.S. used up massive quantities of oil in between the time it became clear that greater conservation was urgently needed and the time that the domestic auto industry finally dropped its fierce resistance to higher fuel efficiency standards.

Sure, becoming preoccupied with negativity towards those who have been intractable doesn't help solve the problem, but neither, often, does treating all parties as equally responsible, since that tends to give a free pass to those contributing disproportionately to the problem that needs solving.
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#5597 - 11/06/09 08:45 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: crarko]
crarko Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Minnesota USA
OK, so I'm kind of a sap for stuff like this:

The Symphony of Science
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The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth. - Niels Bohr

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#5645 - 11/07/09 07:58 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: crarko]
roger Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Vermont
Originally Posted By: crarko
OK, so I'm kind of a sap for stuff like this:

The Symphony of Science


I especially like "A Glorious Dawn".
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#5724 - 11/10/09 04:34 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: roger]
tacit Offline


Registered: 08/03/09
Loc: Portland, Oregon, USA
I made a ringtone from "A Glorious Dawn," which one of my sweeties sent to the guy who did the music...and I just now learned that he put my ringtone on his Web site for download! laugh
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#5821 - 11/14/09 01:12 PM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: crarko]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: crarko
OK, so I'm kind of a sap for stuff like this:

The Symphony of Science

Interesting pieces. It's great that digital technology advances this kind of creativity. I recall when people tried to do "electronic" music in analog and it was a seriously big deal in terms of equipment, and the results were usually received with "it just doesn't sound real".

In the early 70s, Tomita, a Japanese musician did a highly acclaimed electronic music album "Snowflakes Are Dancing" but the equipment credits on the back of the album would suggest he had to rent a barn to house it all.

Now, it probably just takes a laptop and a hundred bucks worth of software.

ryck
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ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
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#5974 - 11/20/09 01:39 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: ryck]
tacit Offline


Registered: 08/03/09
Loc: Portland, Oregon, USA
And, on the theory that there's an XKCD for everything, this XKCD is especially poignant.
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#5975 - 11/20/09 02:56 AM Re: Unexplained Scientific Principles [Re: tacit]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
I recall an interview many years ago with Ansel Adams. I don't recall the exact words of either the question or the answer, but the thrust was about people who would take his images and change them into something else - add colours, manipulate, mix with other things et cetera. He was asked if it bothered him.

His reply was that it didn't. He had created an image based on how his mind thought something should be seen. If someone else "saw" it differently and took it a different direction, it was the natural order of creativity.

There's a lot of art, music, architecture, technology et cetera that simply wouldn't exist if it wasn't for people who think that way. Separate from its output, the creative process itself is an amazing thing to behold.

ryck


Edited by ryck (11/20/09 03:14 AM)
Edit Reason: Added thought
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ryck

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