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#53032 - 12/05/19 10:11 AM iphone and messages blocking
kevs Online


Registered: 12/07/09
Seems if you want to block someone, you have to do two rounds. One on iphone, calls wont do it. For messages you do rigmarole for that too correct? Or am I wrong?


And for messages, I think you have to add the person to you contact, and then block them and then keep them in your contact forever, something like that.?

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#53034 - 12/05/19 01:18 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
THE BLOCKED CALLER AND BLOCKED MESSAGES LISTINGS ARE THE SAME LIST so if you block a phone number, SMS messages from that number are also blocked! (or at least that is true in iOS 13, I just verified that for myself.)
  • To block a phone number
    1. Recommended: If you have a call blocking app (I use Malwarebytes) Go to System > Phone > Call Blocking and Identification and turn the call blocker ON
    2. Go to Recents and click on the info icon at the far right of the number you want to block
    3. scroll down to the bottom of the info screen and click "Block This Caller." That number will be added to the list of blocked phone numbers.
    4. Although blocked numbers may appear as if they are in your contacts list, it is in fact separate from Contacts. (Apple has simply reused the code from Contacts, but pointed to a different database.)
  • To see the numbers on your blocked call list
    1. go to Settings > Phone > Blocked Contacts.
    2. Touch "Edit" at the top of that list to remove number from the blocked call list
    3. At the bottom of the list of blocked phone numbers you will find "add new" that permits adding numbers to your blocked call list without having to enter the person into your Contacts list.
  • To Block text messages:
    1. Go to Settings > Messages > Unknown & Spam and turn Filter "Unknown Senders" ON. If you have message filtering apps such as NoMoRobo or Malwarebytes. you can also select one of those for an additional level of filtering. They are not deleted but go to a separate message list.
    2. To block a particular sender:In a conversation tap the info icon then scroll down and click "block this sender".
    3. To create a blocked message contact: Go to Settings : Messages > Blocked Contacts


Edited by joemikeb (12/05/19 01:23 PM)
Edit Reason: misplaced comma
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#53035 - 12/06/19 08:46 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
kevs Online


Registered: 12/07/09
Thanks Joe! I kind of now 1 and 2 good. But before reading/ absorbing you last paragraph on blocking text:

Confirm: when block a persons phone number.. you have not blocked them from texting you?

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#53036 - 12/06/19 03:44 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Since Messages and Phone use the same list of blocked numbers it does not make any deference whether a phone number is entered from Phone or from Messages — that number is blocked for BOTH phone calls and SMS text messages..

In the case of a blocked iMessage the sender's Email address is entered into the blocked calls/texts list. Whether that blocks email messages from that address as well
I don't know.
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#53037 - 12/06/19 07:37 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
kevs Online


Registered: 12/07/09
Thanks Joe, will study you final paragraph on blocking messages in a bit.. most non - intuitive one.. but question:

I once went to unblock someone once. And among the thousand robo call numbers I have blocked could not find it, as there is no search!
What is up with that?? Or maybe you have answer/tip...

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#53038 - 12/07/19 08:30 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: kevs
Thanks Joe, will study you final paragraph on blocking messages in a bit.. most non - intuitive one..

SMS and MMS text messages use the telephone network and telephone numbers as sending and receiving addresses so it is logical that blocking a telephone number would effect both phone calls and SMS/MMS text messages.

iMessages are an Apple only convention that sends text messages to other Apple devices via the email system using email addresses to identify the sender and receiver. The confusing factor here is Apple uses the same app for SMS, MMS, and iMessages the only obvious differentiation is whether the address is a telephone number or email address. NOTE: There is an option in Settings > Messages that will send an iMessages[/u] via SMS "When iMessage is unavailable". I am not sure how that works?

Originally Posted By: kevs
but question:

I once went to unblock someone once. And among the thousand robo call numbers I have blocked could not find it, as there is no search!
What is up with that?? Or maybe you have answer/tip...

Good point! Siri can find a number in the list of blocked contacts if you put the query in the form of...
Originally Posted By: Siri Query
hey Siri, find 555-555-5555 in the list of blocked contacts

...but all that tells you is the number is in the list and you can't do anything else with that information. They only suggestion I have at the moment is to submit an iPhone feature suggestion and maybe it will turn up in a future release of iOS. 🤷‍♂️

NOTE: I already submitted a suggestion via the beta test Feedback Assistant, but the more submissions the more likely and the sooner an enhancement is likely to the implemented.
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#53039 - 12/07/19 07:02 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
SMS and MMS text messages use the telephone network and telephone numbers as sending and receiving addresses so it is logical that blocking a telephone number would effect both phone calls and SMS/MMS text messages.

iMessages are an Apple only convention that sends text messages to other Apple devices via the email system using email addresses to identify the sender and receiver. The confusing factor here is Apple uses the same app for SMS, MMS, and iMessages the only obvious differentiation is whether the address is a telephone number or email address.

I can send iMessages to either an email address OR a phone number from either my iPhone or MBP.

I first thought it might be a Verizon thing, because both of my devices are Verizon, but Kyoko uses AT&T.


Edited by artie505 (12/07/19 08:07 PM)
Edit Reason: Rewrite
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In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#53040 - 12/08/19 09:16 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: artie505]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Actually it is an Apple thing independent of the telephone carrier. You can turn it on or of in Settings > Messages > Send as SMS (when iMessage is unavailable) in iOS and Messages > Preferences > iMessage in MacOS
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#53041 - 12/08/19 12:59 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
kevs Online


Registered: 12/07/09
Thanks Joe great, I did the feature request now. Horror, once you block someone it's over they swim among thousands of blocked tele-marketers and can't find to unblock. Amazing, boondogle.

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#53042 - 12/08/19 02:31 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: keys
...once you block someone it's over they swim among thousands of blocked tele-marketers and can't find to unblock. Amazing, boondogle.

COMMENT:

Because of Caller ID Spoofing the efficacy of blocking numbers on your iPhone to reduce robo-calls is questionable. The telephone number that appears when you receive a robo-call often has no connection to the robo-caller at all and was generated entirely out of thin air by a computer. It is in all likelihood a one time number used only for the one call you received. It may or may not be a valid number at all, and if it is valid it has no connection with the robo-caller.

Call blocking is efficacious ONLY when there are multiple robo-calls from the same number and that number is an actual number used by the telemarketer and not a spoof. Otherwise you may inadvertently block important calls.

Previously when I receive a robocall I blocked the number in my phone and then shared that number with NoMoRobo, now I only share the number with NoMoRobo and do not block the number on my iPhone. NoMoRobo checks with their own database of reported robocalls and with the database of other agencies that collect such data and if the number is reported often enough it is added to their blocked number list and therefore from my iPhone (and landline phone as well). There are many organizations that collect robocall reports and analyze them to effectively identify numbers used repeatedly by robocallers and many apps that depend on those lists. NoMoRobo is the only app I know of that allows you to directly AND conveniently report robocalls, but I am confident there are others.

Whether or not NoMoRobo and its ilk are effective is a legitimate question. We receive on the average around 50 calls a week on our landline. Of those calls maybe 4 or 5 are legitimate leaving 45 or so questionable calls. For technical reasons on the landline NoMoRobo has to allow one ring before intervening and dropping a robocall. Out of the 45 questionable calls over half are one ring only, so I have to say it is very effective.

NOTE: I have relationship with NoMoRobo other than that of a satisfied subscriber.


Edited by joemikeb (12/08/19 02:34 PM)
Edit Reason: add note
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#53043 - 12/08/19 04:52 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
kevs Online


Registered: 12/07/09
Thanks Joe, well lady at Verizon, says to block anyway.. who knows.

I contacted two 3rd party companies like that and they both don't have ability, to allow the spammer to at least leave a voice mail, so its a deal breaker. I can't trust false positives, so going pass until these servies allow that. Verizon does allow that with their app, but my plan is not eligible to use their app. So stuck.

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#53044 - 12/09/19 12:31 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
That didn't work out right at all, due, for a change, to my typically obscure writing style, so I"ll start over...

Originally Posted By: joemikeb
SMS and MMS text messages use the telephone network and telephone numbers as sending and receiving addresses....

iMessages are an Apple only convention that sends text messages to other Apple devices via the email system using email addresses to identify the sender and receiver.

Those quotes imply that texting is exclusively between phone numbers and iMessaging is exclusively between email addresses, and I was trying to point out that I can send iMessages to either a phone number OR an email address from either my MBP or iPhone.

And SMS/MMS texting doesn't enter into the equation in any way shape or form, because cell service is not enabled on my iPhone.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#53048 - 12/09/19 05:59 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
ryck Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Because of Caller ID Spoofing the efficacy of blocking numbers on your iPhone to reduce robo-calls is questionable. The telephone number that appears when you receive a robo-call often has no connection to the robo-caller at all and was generated entirely out of thin air by a computer. It is in all likelihood a one time number used only for the one call you received. It may or may not be a valid number at all, and if it is valid it has no connection with the robo-caller.

I assume that explains why the call blocking service provided by my landline phone company sometimes says it cannot block the number because: "That number is not available".
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ryck

iMac (Retina 5K, 27", 2017), 3.4 GHz Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, 2400 MHz DDR4
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#53050 - 12/09/19 07:34 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: kevs
Thanks Joe, well lady at Verizon, says to block anyway.. who knows.

I contacted two 3rd party companies like that and they both don't have ability, to allow the spammer to at least leave a voice mail, so its a deal breaker. I can't trust false positives, so going pass until these servies allow that. Verizon does allow that with their app, but my plan is not eligible to use their app. So stuck.

The organizations that collect lists of spam/robo callers have some pretty rigorous standards for placing a number on their list which are intended to reduce the number of false positives. Numbers can age off of most lists as well if they are no longer being reported.

Given spoofers are prone to using phone numbers that appear to be in your area (same area code and even the same prefix) blocking locally could arguably have a higher probability of creating false positive.

Originally Posted By: artie505
And SMS/MMS texting doesn't enter into the equation in any way shape or form, because cell service is not enabled on my iPhone.

Phone number addressing of iMessages works only between Apple devices with an Apple ID. The actual routing is via email not the cellular network. However Apple is capable of injecting a text into the telco network when you are using a device such as a Mac computer that does not have a cellular connection.

Originally Posted By: ryck
I assume that explains why the call blocking service provided by my landline phone company sometimes says it cannot block the number because: "That number is not available".

That would be my assumption as well.


Edited by joemikeb (12/09/19 07:37 AM)
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#53054 - 12/09/19 06:06 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Siri can find a number in the list of blocked contacts if you put the query in the form of...
Originally Posted By: Siri Query
hey Siri, find 555-555-5555 in the list of blocked contacts

...but all that tells you is the number is in the list and you can't do anything else with that information.

I know next to nothing about Siri, so please excuse this if it's a dumb question, but if Siri can find a particular blocked number, why can't it unblock it?
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#53055 - 12/09/19 07:46 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: artie505]
kevs Online


Registered: 12/07/09
Joe, do you know if the company you use allows the spammer to leave a voice mail?

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#53058 - 12/10/19 05:23 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: artie505]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: artie505
I know next to nothing about Siri, so please excuse this if it's a dumb question, but if Siri can find a particular blocked number, why can't it unblock it?

  • Because no one has written the code to implement that ability in Siri?
  • Siri does not have write access to that data base?
  • That would require Siri to play outside of its sandbox which is a no-no in MacOS and a NO-NO in iOS?
  • It may be possible to create a Siri action to do that, but I haven’t figured those out yet


Originally Posted By: keys
Joe, do you know if the company you use allows the spammer to leave a voice mail?

I don’t know of a product that does that. My criteria was finding one that would work with both my cell phone and landline phone. All I can suggest is reading the product descriptions in the AppStore.
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#53067 - 12/11/19 02:18 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Originally Posted By: artie505
I know next to nothing about Siri, so please excuse this if it's a dumb question, but if Siri can find a particular blocked number, why can't it unblock it?
  • Because no one has written the code to implement that ability in Siri?
  • Siri does not have write access to that data base?
  • That would require Siri to play outside of its sandbox which is a no-no in MacOS and a NO-NO in iOS?
  • It may be possible to create a Siri action to do that, but I haven’t figured those out yet

Thanks. I guess I kinda thought that Siri could do anything. crazy
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#53068 - 12/11/19 03:16 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Originally Posted By: artie505
And SMS/MMS texting doesn't enter into the equation in any way shape or form, because cell service is not enabled on my iPhone.

Phone number addressing of iMessages works only between Apple devices with an Apple ID. The actual routing is via email not the cellular network. However Apple is capable of injecting a text into the telco network when you are using a device such as a Mac computer that does not have a cellular connection.

I don't know if this is the same thing, but it's worth mentioning that every cellular provider has got email addresses via which SMS and MMS messages can be sent to/received from a computer.

The ones I know are...

Verizon: <@vtext.com> (SMS) & <@vzwpix.com>( MMS)

AT&T: <@txt.att.net> (SMS) & <@mms.att.net> (MMS)
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#53070 - 12/11/19 10:01 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: artie505]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: artie505
I don't know if this is the same thing, but it's worth mentioning that every cellular provider has got email addresses via which SMS and MMS messages can be sent to/received from a computer.

I had not encountered the email addresses to send texts before, I would assume that as far as the technology goes it is similar, but Apple is the carrier, not a telephone company per. se.

In AT&T's case the recipient of the text must be an AT&T customer number and I would assume the same would be true of Verizon. In Apple's case the only limit on the recipient phone number is the receiving device must be capable of receiving text messages.
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#53079 - 12/12/19 02:51 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: artie505]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: artie505
Thanks. I guess I kinda thought that Siri could do anything. crazy

In iOS13 Siri (a.k.a. voice control) can do a lot that I was not aware of until I saw this MacRumors article a few minutes ago.


Edited by joemikeb (12/12/19 02:52 PM)
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#53080 - 12/12/19 03:08 PM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Thanks for the update, but it'll have to benefit others, because my 5s dead-ends at iOS 12.4.3...not that I've got ANY intention of talking to ANY of my electronic devices...EVER!
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#53082 - 12/13/19 06:28 AM Re: iphone and messages blocking [Re: artie505]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
I knew you would not have voice command on your iPhone but I thought this might be more in line with what you, and many of use, were thinking/hoping Siri could do.

Personally I do talk TO my electronic devices, especially the iPhone because it is so often easier and faster to dictate than to keyboard 🗣. I also mutter and/or shout AT all of them on occasion when they fail to do what I think they should 🤯.
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