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#5046 - 10/15/09 08:31 PM Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Guys, don't use the latest Onyx beta on SL. I launched it a couple of days ago and it started well. It now has a status progress telling you what it is doing. In the middle of automation it crashed (happened to me only once several years ago) without warning. After that, the computer started really thinking at each step. Log in-log out, no deal. Then I launched TinkerTool System, cleaned caches again (this one did not crash), restarted and it was back to normal. I would not use it until the final anymore (or maybe never more).


Edited by cyn (10/17/09 09:28 AM)
Edit Reason: Updated subject.
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Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5058 - 10/16/09 05:08 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
MG2009 Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Just a point of clarification: My original questions in this thread were regarding LEOPARD 10.5 and not SNOW LEOPARD 10.6 - which I believe is the SL referred to in macnerd10's comments.

Note: Perhaps this ONYX (beta) information could also be posted in the SNOW LEOPARD 10.6 Forum for those Mac Users with that OS.


Edited by cyn (10/17/09 09:28 AM)
Edit Reason: Updated subject.

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#5067 - 10/17/09 09:35 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
cyn Online

Administrator

Registered: 08/03/09
This branch of posts was detached from MG2009's Odd MAC OSX INSTALL DVD activity thread and is now a separate topic with a new subject. I'll move it to the Mac OS X Applications forum in a day or two.

Alex, it would be useful for readers of your post to know exactly which version of OnyX you had trouble with, in which version of SL.


Edited by cyn (10/20/09 02:06 AM)
Edit Reason: Thread moved from 'Mac OS X 10.0 - 10.5.x' forum to the 'Mac OS X Applications' forum.
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#5162 - 10/20/09 06:21 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Using any beta product is strictly an "at your own risk" proposition. I have seen products with three and four beta releases a day fixing various bugs as they are discovered. Having said that, I am always installing and using beta versions and very seldom have any problems.
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#5166 - 10/20/09 10:42 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
MarkG Offline


Registered: 08/06/09
I don't run Betas for some of the reasons mentioned earlier, But if I did run one like Oynx which affects stuff, I would run it on my backup drive to see how it works. If there were any problems I could just re-clone from my regular drive.
I usually either wait a week or two on a fully released product that can affect the system or test it my clone first . Mark

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#5177 - 10/20/09 08:40 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: joemikeb]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Sorry for lack of details. I am running 10.6.1 (see my signature) and the beta was 2.1.b4.
I understand the rule but previously trusted this program. Hopefully, the final would not be buggy.
MarkG: excellent habit!


Edited by macnerd10 (10/20/09 08:41 PM)
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Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5288 - 10/24/09 02:01 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
jchuzi Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: New York State
OnyX 2.1b5 is now available.
_________________________
Jon

OS 10.14.3, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

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#5300 - 10/25/09 02:04 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: jchuzi]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Thanks Jon, saw that too. No desire whatsoever to test my fate again. Will wait until it gets out of beta. Maybe my case is isolated, but this program can cripple the machine if something goes wrong. Besides, TinkerTool System and Socks can do essentially the same and they seem to be stable.


Edited by macnerd10 (10/25/09 02:08 AM)
_________________________
Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5301 - 10/25/09 06:50 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
MarkG Offline


Registered: 08/06/09
You might want to look into Cocktail - 4.5.2 (Snow Leopard Edition) general purpose system modify/repair utility. It costs $14.95 and has a good reputation. I would be curious what other members thought. I have used it a number of times on my backup and have no problems so far. If you use it, look at Pilot (mode) to start with.


Edited by MarkG (10/25/09 06:54 AM)

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#5303 - 10/25/09 08:06 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: MarkG]
jchuzi Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: New York State
I use Cocktail 4.4.1 in Leopard, mostly in Pilot mode, and it has always worked well for me. I anticipate no problems with the Snow Leopard version.
_________________________
Jon

OS 10.14.3, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

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#5308 - 10/25/09 01:18 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: jchuzi]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
This is one of the few utilities I still don't have. I guess it is time to take a plunge.
Thanks!
_________________________
Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5315 - 10/25/09 04:42 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
How many "Swiss Army Knife" type utilities (that litter the Mac landscape with duplicate functionality that most users virtually never call on) does one really need, Alex?

Other than for periodic maintenance, how often do you call on any of your utilities (and I'm talking about troubleshooting, not "feature tweaking")?

If you've got a moment, I'd love to see a list of the utilities you're running and their unique and necessary functionalities that have induced you to d/l, perhaps even pay for, them.

Thanks.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#5323 - 10/25/09 08:39 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: artie505]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Well, Artie, you may be quite right. Currently, I have TechTool Pro, DiskWarrior, Socks, Snow Leopard Cache cleaner, Tinker Tool (from old times) and Tinker Tool System. Now the big question is what and how often I use!
DW - about twice a year if anything goes wrong (I have a bad habit of not using DU from the install disk). With Tiger and Leopard, got a couple problems with directory and that was fixed.
TTP - also about once a year as a heavy artillery.
SL cache cleaner - about once in two-three months just for caches in an attempt to speed up the machine a bit. Used to do it with Onyx but not any more.
TT - not any more because I got TTS recently. Used it a couple of times, lately to clean the little mess Onyx crash left.
I agree that all these utilities except, possibly, DW have common tasks including cache cleaning and permissions repair (I relegate the latter now to SuperDuper!). They also have something of their own. It would be nice to get a comparison of such utilities (maintenance and repair), with lists of what they are primarily for.
I guess, this would be a nice FAQ topic, very useful for the general membership me included.
P.S. One of the reasons I keep more than 3 is that, when a new OS comes up, they are not equally fast and efficient at updating, so I am trying to keep something that works. This is debatable tactics, I know.
_________________________
Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5325 - 10/25/09 10:42 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
> This is debatable tactics, I know.

Not if it makes you feel comfortable, Alex, and this is, after all, America... The land of the free and the home of the insurance salesman.

I dunno... I look at the list of functionalities some maintenance apps offer and wonder whether the vast majority of users ever need to avail themselves of any of them.

Many of the apps have become "bloatware" simply because of a need to keep up with each other in offering a fix for the latest obscure glitch.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#5333 - 10/26/09 05:54 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: jchuzi]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: jchuzi
I use Cocktail 4.4.1 in Leopard, mostly in Pilot mode, and it has always worked well for me. I anticipate no problems with the Snow Leopard version.


Indeed you are correct (as well as omniscient). Cocktail 4.5.2 (SL Edition) works as expected, at least for me.
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#5345 - 10/26/09 02:07 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: Pendragon]
jchuzi Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: New York State
Thanks, Harv. That's good to know. I'll probably be upgrading to SL sometime before Thanksgiving and I'll upgrade my version of Cocktail as well.
_________________________
Jon

OS 10.14.3, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

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#5352 - 10/26/09 09:38 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: artie505]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Originally Posted By: artie505
How many "Swiss Army Knife" type utilities (that litter the Mac landscape with duplicate functionality that most users virtually never call on) does one really need, Alex?

Other than for periodic maintenance, how often do you call on any of your utilities (and I'm talking about troubleshooting, not "feature tweaking")?

If you've got a moment, I'd love to see a list of the utilities you're running and their unique and necessary functionalities that have induced you to d/l, perhaps even pay for, them.

I'm with artie on this one. We don't need automated cache cleaning or periodic task priming anymore. About the only such utility i "use" is AppleJack... but basically -- after installing it -- it just sits there forever waiting for an emergency to occur (so i can run it from single-user mode). I suppose i could run it as a matter of some routine... but that's quite unnecessary. Better to learn a handful of useful Terminal commands and save them for those rare occasions (e.g., sudo launchctl start com.apple.periodic-monthly), and/or know basic stuff (e.g., doing a Safe Boot for font cache cleaning), etc.

I've heard TinkerTool System has a pretty good ACL section... so maybe using its GUI for that purpose might be worth the dough for some users. [ACLs are a bit trickier than basic permissions.] But generally speaking, macosxhints.com is a good source for such technical info [and quite likely is the same place where the authors of these utilities find most of the commands they use in their wares.]

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#5355 - 10/26/09 11:16 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: Hal Itosis]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
> Better to learn a handful of useful Terminal commands [....]

That's my approach (Applejack, too, of course); it not only keeps your HD uncluttered, it teaches you about both OS X and your Mac.


Edited by artie505 (10/26/09 11:18 PM)
Edit Reason: (xxx)
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#5357 - 10/26/09 11:26 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: Hal Itosis]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Fully agree!
Another request for FAQ section - would you write an article about some basic maintenance Terminal commands since you know it so well? That would be a big help for a lot of people.
BTW, does AppleJack still run with fans on full blast?
_________________________
Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5379 - 10/27/09 10:15 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
MarkG Offline


Registered: 08/06/09
I have been running Applejack on myiMac 2.16 GHZ Intel Core 2 Duo, 2 GB ram with 105.8 for quite a while with no problems. The fans have never kicked in.
As far as I know Applejack is NOT compatible yet with Snow Leopard

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#5397 - 10/27/09 03:26 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Originally Posted By: macnerd10
Another request for FAQ section - would you write an article about some basic maintenance Terminal commands since you know it so well?

Okay . . . eventually.

Originally Posted By: macnerd10
BTW, does AppleJack still run with fans on full blast?

Applejack was never the cause of that. Some models (like the iMac G5 sitting across the room here) will ramp up its fans simply due to booting into single-user mode.

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#5424 - 10/27/09 10:53 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: Hal Itosis]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Quote:
Applejack was never the cause of that. Some models (like the iMac G5 sitting across the room here) will ramp up its fans simply due to booting into single-user mode.

True. Nonetheless, booting in single-user mode was not the same as sitting in single-user mode. The program needed time to work (especially, with deep cleaning) and all the while the fans were crazy without the computer control. So, I wonder if this continues on newer models (must be, I guess).


Edited by macnerd10 (10/28/09 10:04 AM)
Edit Reason: correct mistakes in content
_________________________
Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5429 - 10/27/09 11:40 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Originally Posted By: macnerd10
True. Nonetheless, booting in safe single-user mode was not the same as sitting in safe single-user mode. The program needed time to work (especially, with deep cleaning) and all the while the fans were crazy without the computer control.

I don't think it hurt the fans any. They are designed to withstand a certain maximum voltage, and i doubt Apple would allow that maximum to be exceeded under any circumstance. [well, hopefully.] And -- if anything -- it kept the iMac (CPU, etc) as cool as possible. grin

I think the main 'problems' were that it either scared users or drove them crazy with all that vacuum cleaner noise going on.

Originally Posted By: macnerd10
So, I wonder if this continues on newer models (must be, I guess).

Not my MacBook Pro, or any PowerBook i've ever owned. I think single-user mode is usually very quiet and stable for the most part (the exception being the iMac G5... and maybe not every model of iMac G5 either, idunno). I'd say there's probably more discussion of fan noise in this thread than anywhere else on the web (since 2007 or so?). I use single-user mode for occasional fsck -fy runs when i'm bored. It is so much faster than DVD booting it's ridonkulous.

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#5440 - 10/28/09 10:03 AM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: Hal Itosis]
macnerd10 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Sorry for the mistakes! And thanks for the good info! You are absolutely right about the scare. That was my reaction several years ago, after which I aborted the cleaning to find a havoc on my computer that required A&I. I have then deleted AJ and never used it. Maybe it is time to get it again but, as you say, is there any need unless something goes really wrong?
_________________________
Alex
3.1 GHz 13" MacBook Pro 2015, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, TimeWarner Cable
2.8 GHz Xeon Mac Pro 2010, 16 GB RAM, OS 10.11.2, Office 2011, LAN

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#5447 - 10/28/09 03:43 PM Re: Problem with latest OnyX beta in Snow Leopard [Re: macnerd10]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Originally Posted By: macnerd10
Maybe it is time to get it again but, as you say, is there any need unless something goes really wrong?

I suppose that's up to the individual user.
AFAIK, AppleJack only offers these 5 tasks:

• repair disk
• repair permissions
• cleanup cache files
• validate pref files
• cleanup virtual memory

The first one we can do simply with fsck -fy. The second one (permissions) is more complicated, because a few frameworks need to be loaded before we can use the diskutil binary in SU mode. Cache cleaning (3), pref validating (4) with plutil, and VM removing (5) are similarly matters related to troubleshooting... not anything normally considered as "maintenance".

I think AJ's purpose really comes into focus when there is some problem which either:
• prevents login (else we could just as easily do the first 4 while logged in) or,
• prevents Disk Utility (or Terminal, etc.) from working while logged in.

It's really handy for portable Mac users (*Book machines), because we don't need to lug around our boot DVD for certain things (i.e., the 5 tasks listed above). [it's important to remember that AJ needs to be "installed" before some login problem happens, else it'll be too late.]

idunno, maybe once a year i might deep clean all caches for the heck of it... but that's not really a routine we need for any reason. I do however run fsck or (more often) *verify* various backup volumes (etc) with Disk Utility from time to time. That may also fall in line with "change the oil in the car" type of thinking, which makes us users feel productive [or something?]. So anyway, i guess i'm guilty of that sort of activity to some degree as well. But i try to keep it to a reasonable minimum.

--

FWIW, Dan Frakes wrote a review of version 1.5 last year, and the word "fan" was mentioned:  wink
I’m a big fan of AppleJack, but you don’t have to be a troubleshooting expert to appreciate it.



Edited by Hal Itosis (10/28/09 06:52 PM)

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