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#47811 - 02/04/18 06:20 PM Word weirdness
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Ever since I installed El Capitan MS Word for Mac 2011 (version 14.7.7) has been going through 'contortions' which seem to revolve around the "Lucida Grande" font: Over and over again at any given go, it seems to be trying to troubleshoot/correct something (which I can't identify from Console's log messages) and apparently cannot.

I don't use this font nor does any app I do use.

What is the current wisdom in order to get rid of this annoyance along with its dozens of lines of error messages in Console?

Should I just delete Lucida Grande from my font list, and if so, how is that accomplished?

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#47812 - 02/04/18 06:34 PM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
I don't know what's up with Word (I'd try reinstalling it...uninstalling it first if possible.), but Lucida Grande is a system font (/System/Library/Fonts/LucidaGrande.ttc), so trashing it is a baaad idea, i.e. you'd be trashing it without knowing where the OS is using it and wouldn't know what you broke until you cut yourself on the shards.

More: Before reinstalling Word, you ought to launch /Apps/Font Book and check Lucida Grande to make sure it isn't problematic in some way.

(Can you authoritatively state that no app you use uses Lucida Grande in its GUI?)


Edited by artie505 (02/04/18 07:48 PM)
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47813 - 02/05/18 01:07 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
Before reinstalling Word, you ought to launch /Apps/Font Book and check Lucida Grande to make sure it isn't problematic in some way.

I looked at it as suggested but I'm not sure how I might determine if something is problematic. It shows up in the listing. I created a Word document with it with no problem.

Some of the error log messages suggest that Word is looking for and update. A foray to do same returns "no updates available" — which I would have anticipated since Word 14.7.7 is the last current update.

Reinstalling Word (or all of Office for the Mac 2011) is not an option.

Originally Posted By: artie505
(Can you authoritatively state that no app you use uses Lucida Grande in its GUI?)

No.

I've also been getting a whack of GoogleSoftware Update Daemon and RTProtection Daemon error messages relating to updating which never go to completion. Truly weird.

I've expunged Opera and Chrome from my Applications folder. Using AppCleaner gets rid of all the ancillary bits which remain behind if only the app is deleted.
Thus far I've seen no more of the error messages referred to above. Nor has the Lucida Grande issue shown up. So I'm guessing that those problems were all somehow connected. We shall see.

On the other hand the following 2 error messages have been showing up (repeatedly) and I don't know what to make of them —

2018-02-05 6:00:16.035 plugin-container[35078]: CFPasteboardRef CFPasteboardCreate(CFAllocatorRef, CFStringRef) : failed to create global data

2018-02-05 6:00:16.035 plugin-container[35078]: FolderManager: Failed looking up user domain root; url='file:///Users/grelber/' path=- err=-1 uid=501 euid=501

Also, if I delete the updatejournal.plist entry (under Library > Application Support > App Store), would that get rid of the 2 on the App Store icon (and not do any other damage)?


Edited by grelber (02/05/18 03:15 AM)
Edit Reason: Additional concerns

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#47816 - 02/05/18 04:39 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Originally Posted By: artie505
Before reinstalling Word, you ought to launch /Apps/Font Book and check Lucida Grande to make sure it isn't problematic in some way.

I looked at it as suggested but I'm not sure how I might determine if something is problematic.

If there's a problem with a font, Font Book tells you, so nothing = nothing.

Originally Posted By: grelber
I've expunged Opera and Chrome from my Applications folder. Using AppCleaner gets rid of all the ancillary bits which remain behind if only the app is deleted.
Thus far I've seen no more of the error messages referred to above. Nor has the Lucida Grande issue shown up. So I'm guessing that those problems were all somehow connected. We shall see.

Fingers crossed.

Originally Posted By: grelber
On the other hand the following 2 error messages have been showing up (repeatedly) and I don't know what to make of them —

2018-02-05 6:00:16.035 plugin-container[35078]: CFPasteboardRef CFPasteboardCreate(CFAllocatorRef, CFStringRef) : failed to create global data

2018-02-05 6:00:16.035 plugin-container[35078]: FolderManager: Failed looking up user domain root; url='file:///Users/grelber/' path=- err=-1 uid=501 euid=501

The best I can do with that is suggest that you quit looking in Console other than with reason. wink

Originally Posted By: grelber
Also, if I delete the updatejournal.plist entry (under Library > Application Support > App Store), would that get rid of the 2 on the App Store icon (and not do any other damage)?

In Sierra, /Users/artie/Library/Application Support/App Store/updatejournal.plist seems to be the App Store's source for "Updates Installed in the Last 30 Days", and if that holds for El Cap, deleting the file won't get rid of your "2".

I think it's been posted that there's a way to tell the App Store to disregard unwanted updates, but I can't verify it.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47817 - 02/05/18 06:21 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
I think it's been posted that there's a way to tell the App Store to disregard unwanted updates, but I can't verify it.

There is, according to Urquhart*, but it requires access via App Store which I can't access in finite time (if at all) and even so there are restrictions on what can and cannot be disregarded.
[* ... you can selectively disable (hide) existing notifications about specific software updates you don't care about by control-clicking the update inside the App Store to reveal a hidden "Hide Update" option. It is not available for everything, though (some apps).]

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#47821 - 02/05/18 09:46 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
It may be premature to judge but all those annoying error messages clearly seem to have been related to Chrome and Opera trying to "phone home" and somehow that Lucida Grande issue was associated with same. So I won't be enabling either of those unless I get desperate.

That behavior seems to have been related to those browsers trying to update themselves automatically in whole or in part, but my not being hooked up with the Internet on a constant basis seems to have thwarted their efforts. I could find no way to disable automatic updating in Chrome; I never examined Opera in that fashion.

Firefox doesn't seem to engage in such behavior; but as with all apps where I'm given the option I've only enabled manual updating. Safari doesn't either, but I can't find any way to manage updating.

Bottom line: Word was not the culprit.

It was beauty killed the beast.
— Grâce à King Kong (1933)

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#47822 - 02/05/18 10:13 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Thinking about it, the App Store must be connecting to your iMac at some point and for some period of time or your "2" wouldn't be there in the first place, so perhaps you ought to think around visiting the App Store and visit /Apps/System Prefs/App Store and allow El Cap to d/l and install the updates for you. Yeah, you may not necessarily want them, but coming directly from Apple they won't do you any harm, and if you're really hot to get rid of the "2", this may be your only way.

CAVEAT: You've got no idea what your missing updates are (*), so you've got no idea how long the d/l's will take nor how much they'll drag on your browsing while in process, nor do I know if they can be halted once they've begun.

Now there's a Catch-22 for ya! laugh

(*) Since you've d/l'ed the iTunes and Security Updates directly from Apple, I don't think those remaining are likely to be very large, but that's just a wiiild guess.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47823 - 02/05/18 10:18 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Firefox doesn't seem to engage in such behavior; but as with all apps where I'm given the option I've only enabled manual updating. Safari doesn't either, but I can't find any way to manage updating.

Bottom line: Word was not the culprit.

Bottom line: cool

Some recent Safari updates have been included in macOS updates, and others have been available only from the App Store; there's no aye/nay option within the app.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47826 - 02/05/18 11:38 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: grelber
Firefox doesn't seem to engage in such behavior; but as with all apps where I'm given the option I've only enabled manual updating. Safari doesn't either, but I can't find any way to manage updating.

I cannot verify if this is available in El Capitan but in High Sierra anything coming through the App Store, including Safari and MacOS can be at least partially controlled by going to System Preferences > App Store and disabling "Automatically check for updates".
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#47828 - 02/05/18 11:55 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
... the App Store must be connecting to your iMac at some point and for some period of time or your "2" wouldn't be there in the first place, so perhaps you ought to think around visiting the App Store and visit /Apps/System Prefs/App Store and allow El Cap to d/l and install the updates for you. Yeah, you may not necessarily want them, but coming directly from Apple they won't do you any harm, and if you're really hot to get rid of the "2", this may be your only way.

Not so much ...

Repeated attempts to access the App Store yielded equally repeated crap-outs; following is a small sample —

2018-02-05 2:24:39.209 App Store[36923]: serverError Error Domain=NSURLErrorDomain Code=-1001 "The request timed out." UserInfo={NSUnderlyingError=0x7fcdd37b5310 {Error Domain=kCFErrorDomainCFNetwork Code=-1001 "The request timed out." UserInfo={NSErrorFailingURLStringKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/top.pdf, NSErrorFailingURLKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/top.pdf, _kCFStreamErrorCodeKey=-2102, _kCFStreamErrorDomainKey=4, NSLocalizedDescription=The request timed out.}}, NSErrorFailingURLStringKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/top.pdf, NSErrorFailingURLKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/top.pdf, _kCFStreamErrorDomainKey=4, _kCFStreamErrorCodeKey=-2102, NSLocalizedDescription=The request timed out.}

2018-02-05 2:25:20.502 App Store[36923]: CFNetwork SSLHandshake failed (-9802)

2018-02-05 2:25:48.570 App Store[36923]: serverError Error Domain=NSURLErrorDomain Code=-1200 "An SSL error has occurred and a secure connection to the server cannot be made." UserInfo={_kCFStreamErrorCodeKey=-9802, NSLocalizedRecoverySuggestion=Would you like to connect to the server anyway?, NSUnderlyingError=0x7fcdd34892e0 {Error Domain=kCFErrorDomainCFNetwork Code=-1200 "An SSL error has occurred and a secure connection to the server cannot be made." UserInfo={NSErrorFailingURLStringKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/featured.pdf, NSLocalizedRecoverySuggestion=Would you like to connect to the server anyway?, _kCFNetworkCFStreamSSLErrorOriginalValue=-9802, _kCFStreamPropertySSLClientCertificateState=0, NSLocalizedDescription=An SSL error has occurred and a secure connection to the server cannot be made., _kCFStreamErrorDomainKey=3, NSErrorFailingURLKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/featured.pdf, _kCFStreamErrorCodeKey=-9802}}, NSLocalizedDescription=An SSL error has occurred and a secure connection to the server cannot be made., NSErrorFailingURLKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/featured.pdf, NSErrorFailingURLStringKey=https://s.mzstatic.com/images/html_resources/da-storefront/tab_bar_modern/featured.pdf, _kCFStreamErrorDomainKey=3}

Movin' on. Time for another glass of wine.

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#47829 - 02/05/18 01:29 PM Re: Word weirdness [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Originally Posted By: grelber
Firefox doesn't seem to engage in such behavior; but as with all apps where I'm given the option I've only enabled manual updating. Safari doesn't either, but I can't find any way to manage updating.

I cannot verify if this is available in El Capitan but in High Sierra anything coming through the App Store, including Safari and MacOS can be at least partially controlled by going to System Preferences > App Store and disabling "Automatically check for updates".

Duuuh!!! :dope-slap:

That seems like it might make grelber's "2" disappear.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47833 - 02/05/18 03:33 PM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
...
That seems like it might make grelber's "2" disappear.


Not after the fact. I tried that after the 2 appeared; it apparently only works for future updates. It won't 'erase' what came before (unless and until the updates denoted are downloaded and installed — or so I presume). So that's another dead end.

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#47835 - 02/05/18 05:02 PM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Repeated attempts to access the App Store yielded equally repeated crap-outs; following is a small sample —

2018-02-05 2:24:39.209 App Store[36923]: serverError Error Domain=NSURLErrorDomain Code=-1001 "The request timed out."....

2018-02-05 2:25:20.502 App Store[36923]: CFNetwork SSLHandshake failed (-9802)

2018-02-05 2:25:48.570 App Store[36923]: serverError Error Domain=NSURLErrorDomain Code=-1200 "An SSL error has occurred and a secure connection to the server cannot be made."....

Under what circumstances were those console messages generated?
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47837 - 02/05/18 11:11 PM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
Under what circumstances were those console messages generated?

I'm not sure what you're asking since I prefaced the error messages with "Repeated attempts to access the App Store yielded equally repeated crap-outs; following is a small sample".
They were generated when while online I opened the AppStore app which tried (repeatedly) to connect to the App Store, only to have the app quit with the message "Cannot Connect to the App Store". (And it just performed the exact same way when I tried it again.)

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#47838 - 02/06/18 01:20 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Originally Posted By: artie505
Under what circumstances were those console messages generated?

They were generated when while online I opened the AppStore app which tried (repeatedly) to connect to the App Store, only to have the app quit with the message "Cannot Connect to the App Store".

Now you've answered my question.

I was wondering whether those errors were generated by your trying to access the App Store or merely clicking on /System Prefs > App Store > Check Now, which accesses the Store on a different, i.e. less demanding, level.

The "2" makes it apparent that your iMac has connected to the App Store at some point, and I was wondering if there was something to be learned.

At any rate, the direction in which I was going was less than ideal...even unpalatable, so I'm dropping it.

See my next post.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47839 - 02/06/18 01:41 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
The "2" makes it apparent that your iMac has connected to the App Store at some point, and I was wondering if there was something to be learned.

Apparently it came via Notifications before I could disable ALL Notifications. Since then nothing has been added; ergo, frozen at "2".

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#47840 - 02/06/18 01:42 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Originally Posted By: artie505
...
That seems like it might make grelber's "2" disappear.


Not after the fact. I tried that after the 2 appeared; it apparently only works for future updates. It won't 'erase' what came before (unless and until the updates denoted are downloaded and installed — or so I presume). So that's another dead end.

That really got me thinking that the "2" must be cached somewhere on your iMac, so I went looking and found /Library/Preferences/com.apple.SoftwareUpdate.plist which includes

Code:
<key>LastUpdatesAvailable</key>
	<integer>0</integer>


which, I believe, is where your "2" lives, and I think this procedure will get rid of it:
  1. Navigate to System Prefs > App Store.
  2. Make sure that "Automatically check for updates" is NOT checked.
  3. Quit System Prefs.
  4. Navigate to /Library/Preferences/com.apple.SoftwareUpdate.plist.
  5. Trash it. (You'll probably be asked to authenticate with your Admin password.)
  6. Empty the trash.
  7. Shut down.
  8. Start up.
Hopefully, your "2" will be gone.

FULL DISCLOSURE:
  • On the one hand, there's enough data stored on your iMac for macOS to recreate at least part of the trashed file. (The rest requires App Store access.)
  • But on the other hand, System Prefs .plists are notorious for not regenerating after being trashed.
  • On the third hand, though, Software Update is a dead issue in your instance, so you've got nothing to lose but your "2".
More: I forgot to mention that I more or less confirmed my theory by changing my "0" to a "1" and then launching the App Store and actually seeing the "1" revert to a "0" in the open .plist as I watched.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47841 - 02/06/18 01:51 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Originally Posted By: artie505
The "2" makes it apparent that your iMac has connected to the App Store at some point, and I was wondering if there was something to be learned.

Apparently it came via Notifications before I could disable ALL Notifications. Since then nothing has been added; ergo, frozen at "2".

Notifications got it from somewhere else...Software Update, I assume, so disabling it wouldn't have anything to do with anything.

Your number is probably frozen at "2" because you're running an OS that's pretty much unsupported at this point and just hasn't had any new updates pointed at it lately.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47844 - 02/06/18 06:14 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Variation on a theme:

In El Capitan on my iMac the info you find in /Library/Preferences/com.apple.SoftwareUpdate.plist is located in com.apple.appstore.plist, namely
<key>appStoreBadgeCount</key> <integer>2</integer>

I could open that with TextWrangler* and change the 2 to a 0. (* Apparently all plist items are TextWrangler documents.)

I then shut down and restarted, et voilà — problem resolved (at least for now).

So, merci beaucoup for providing the direction.

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#47846 - 02/06/18 08:01 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
I've got the same .plist (which I obviously didn't manage to find) with the same data string in Sierra, and I suspect that you've gone me one better and hit on the real answer, but I can't check, because I haven't got any updates waiting at the App Store.

At any rate, I'm happy to have pointed you in the right direction, and I'll guess that your problem's resolved for good as long as "Check Now" ISN'T checked in System Prefs > App Store.

.Plists open in both TextWrangler and TextEdit, but the latter doesn't show you a readily editable format.

(I thought of suggesting that you edit the .plist I found with TextWrangler, but I didn't know if you had it and took the easy way out. tongue )
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#47971 - 02/12/18 11:50 PM Re: Word weirdness [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
Originally Posted By: grelber
Originally Posted By: artie505
Before reinstalling Word, you ought to launch /Apps/Font Book and check Lucida Grande to make sure it isn't problematic in some way.

I looked at it as suggested but I'm not sure how I might determine if something is problematic.

If there's a problem with a font, Font Book tells you, so nothing = nothing.

Back to the original complaint: All of a sudden the Lucida Grande 'contortions' returned, with 4000+ lines of machinations reported in Console.
So I went to OnyX and cleaned house, deleting the Fonts cache and restarting.
MS Word reset itself (as expected), a few websites took slightly longer to render (as OnyX advised), and Console seems to be happy.
As artie says: Fingers crossed.

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#48008 - 02/18/18 08:21 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: grelber
Back to the original complaint: All of a sudden the Lucida Grande 'contortions' returned, with 4000+ lines of machinations reported in Console.
So I went to OnyX and cleaned house, deleting the Fonts cache and restarting.
MS Word reset itself (as expected), a few websites took slightly longer to render (as OnyX advised), and Console seems to be happy.
As artie says: Fingers crossed.

Well, it's been 5 days and the Lucida Grande issue hasn't raised its ugly head. So, I guess that OnyX did the trick in curing the glitch.

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#48018 - 02/20/18 01:24 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
It's baaaack ... crazy mad confused

I spoke too soon. The Lucida Grande 'contortions' have returned.

If I were to guess, it would seem that something — either periodically or spasmodically — has corrupted that particular font in one or more ways to the point that Microsoft Word finds it necessary to try to fix it but cannot.

I can determine no inciting cause or situation. It can happen under virtually any circumstance, whether I'm online or not, with no common precursors. It seems to run itself randomly (and sometimes exasperatingly temporally repeatedly). [Whew! How's that for 3 adverbs in a row?]

So, unless someone has a brilliant idea about how to deal with it, I'm just going to have to ignore/endure it.

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#49180 - 06/24/18 02:31 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
It's been over 4 months now and the "contortions" continue: Every time I open any Word document (irrespective of font, although my default font is Verdana), Word immediately starts — seemingly — looking to correct something with respect to the Lucida Grande font (all sizes), generating several thousand lines of description in Console, and apparently finding nothing and repairing nothing. The process doesn't seem to alter the functionality of Word.

So I just thought I'd revisit the issue here to see if anyone might have more intelligence on the matter.

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#49182 - 06/24/18 03:31 AM Re: Word weirdness [Re: grelber]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Not that I have a clue re these "contortions" of have even heard of such... still, I would hate for the lack of knowledge to impede my offering an opinion or suggestion-

What happens when you open Font Book and then "validate" all fonts, and, "look for enabled duplicates"?

I'm thinking[?] that the Lucida Grande file itself, or the µS font cache is corrupt and may need (re)installation/purging.

Sorry if my help is not...
_________________________
Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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