Home Forums Mac Software Mac Applications Anyone using Office? Advice on upgrading.

Anyone else using Office 2011? Should I upgrade to 2016? They just stopped supporting 2011.

There is nothing I need beyond what I have, but I did read that 2016 is good. Any opinons? Could 2011 stop working with Mac OS sooner than 2011? Thanks

I'm still getting updates to 2011...got one today, so they haven't stopped supporting it just yet, but since it's 32 bit, it will run only through macOS 10.14 (the next version, which is due out in the fall), but maybe not with full functionality, and it absolutely will NOT run in macOS 10.15.

I use only Excel, and plan to switch to Apple's Numbers, which looks like it won't be a problem for me once I get over the GUI shock; I'll lose available functionality, but none that's necessary.

I haven't investigated 2016, but I expect that it's 64 bit and will run after 2011 has become a dead issue.

Thanks Artie so 2011 wont work long term? Darn But I'm thinking of Office 2016, which is still a one time stand alone price, not subscription... That will have same functionality. I only use Word and Excel. 2

BTW, I see offers for $30 but would you only trust buying from Microsoft?

Also I have old copy of Quicken for Mac 2007, which I'm happy with. Their new version 2108 is subscription only which I loathe-- to pay annually. Will that stop working with future Quicken 2007 ?
computers?

I've never heard about this 32 bit issue. Everything has to be beyond 32 bit?

I can't give you any real details, but I can tell you that apps are either 32 or 64 bit, and that ALL your 32 bit apps will cease to be functional in macOS 10.15. (I expect that I'm not the only one here who's going to lose cherished, irreplaceable apps. )

I'm still considering Office 2016 (if I can't get acclimated to Numbers), which I'd buy on eBay, as I did with Office 2008 and 2011, but only in original, sealed Microsoft packaging. (I once bought an Office 2011 cheapie on eBay, and it turned out to NOT be a d/l from Microsoft as advertised. eBay took care of me, though...even banged the offender for $8 return postage on a useless CD, and I learned my lesson in the bargain.)

I've got no knowledge of Quicken, but I'll guess that the 2007 version is 32 bit.

The "smart" (read "greedy") developers out there, one of which I'll guess is Microsoft, saved 64 bit as an excuse to force users into a paid upgrade.

Interesting stuff, now gotta go to 64 bit..
But now no packaging..? All download... and worse going to yearly subscription?

Others try Numbers?

I hope that if any of my apps ever require my going on a subscription basis I'll be able to find replacements.

As an experiment, you can launch Numbers and use command-O to open an Excel file to get an idea of what its GUI looks like; you can also experiment with its functionality and just not "Save Changes".

Office for Mac 2016 is a stand alone suite of programs that lives on your computer just like Office for Mac 2011......Office 365 is the subscription version of those same Office 2016 programs and requires an annual renewal to keep functioning.

I've purchased and installed the Office 2016 suite and it works just fine.

Thanks Mac, yes I knew it was standalone, sadly, it probably is last before they go to the gauging subscription method that Adobe pioneered right?

Do you concur with Art that software's will need to be 64 bit?

How do you like 2016? How much did you pay and where did you buy?

If Art is right about 64 bit, then I should get it in any case right?

On Microsofs website it says "For One Mac", what does that mean?

Hah?!

The last (and apparently final) update was 14.7.7 on September 7, 2017. What did you get?

Huh? I got 14.7.7, dated 9-7-2017, for at least the third time, now that I think about it.

Dunno what's up with that.

FWIW: My Office 2011 apps themselves did not get an update yesterday, but the AutoUpdate piece did. It is now version 3.17.18031100 (21 Mar 18).

Perhaps that's what happened...

Thanks for that, Harv.

I've got the same version of AutoUpdate as you've got, so that's probably what my update was; I never look at what Microsoft has bestowed upon me...just click on "Go!"

As I said, I've gotten multiple 2011 updates since Microsoft stoped supporting it, so I guess they've all been to extraneous components of 2011, maybe all to AutoUpdate, rather than to the apps themselves.

Which of course leaves me wondering why Microsoft is updating the auto-update component of an app that's no longer being updated?

I agree that 64 bit applications are soon to become a requirement to work under future versions of Mac OS.....for now, 32 bit apps are still supported through the current Mac OS. I updated to Office 2016 for this reason. I watched for a discounted sale version through several online vendors, and ultimately pulled the trigger using Fry's Electronics. It was about 25% off of suggested retail.....

At some point in the future, you will need to face the 64 bit issue with replacement apps for those programs you wish to continue using once 32 bit apps are no longer supported.

"For one Mac" is the legal phraseology in the license agreement....it simply means that Microsoft doesn't want to allow you to use their software on multiple computers. It implies that you will need to buy a new license if you change computers, but that was not my experience when I migrated to my new computer. The new me still had a functional Office suite while the old me retained functionality as well.....legally, I did the right thing by removing Office 2016 from my prior MBP before passing it to its' new owner.

When I worked for Microsoft Tech Support the official interpretation of "for one Mac" was you could only use it on one Mac at a time. Other phraseology in the license agreement permitted installation on a work computer and a home computer but legally you could not have the Microsoft app open on both computers AT THE SAME TIME. Enforcing that turned out to be highly problematic and I believe was a significant driving factor in Microsoft's decision to go to a software leasing model as opposed to sales. (A bigger driving factor in that decision was market saturation in a declining market and the necessity to generate stable cash flow to keep Microsoft in business.)

Adobe (luckily) still allows [1.1] office and home copies (2 devices, but not in use simultaneously), even with their leasing model, just as before the leasing model. How their software is used is easier to track now, and it is easier to do something about (serious) license violations.

When I got my new MBP I had forgotten that my Office 2011 was "For One Mac Only", so I didn't uninstall it from my old one, but, same as you, I was able to install it all the same. (My old MBP went back to Apple, so my having failed to uninstall it was legally inconsequential.)

Thanks Mac, does the one computer mean I can have it on my desktop and my laptop without having to pay twice? (this is what all previous version have allowed), still confused. Though when I do upgrade either of those it is indeed a pita with office to get it back on. Will that be an issue? But you think it should be one time fee for both laptop and desktop?

I see it advertised $29 on I think bonanza site, this guy selling it says it's good for 5 devices. I called him on phone, and he was nice/ professional, seems ok but who knows? You wonder if Chinese/ Russians have invented a perfect clone and are selling around..? Is there a way to preview 2016 office to see what it looks like first from microsoft?

BTW Artie mentioned numbers. I'm Excel Word guy for 15 years, could you get used to using Numbers? They would both convert word/ excel files ok? I still think easy to get Office 2016 for one time fee, and should last another 5-6 years, but then it's toast right once subscription only, concur? How do you like 2016 vs 2011?

Joe, thanks! "or one Mac" was you could only use it on one Mac at a time"
Ok finally have an definitive answer.... and I never use it more than on one Mac at a time, so laptop/ desktop should be ok as before?

Leasing, I'm going it with Adobe now $10 month, but I get LIghtroom and PS and free Portfolio. For Office or Quicken Leasing is about 5 times as expensive as before.

"If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is....."

That sounds very much to me like an eBay / CraigsList scam for pirated software.

YMMV / Buyer beware....

I bought my scam-ware Office 2011 on eBay...risked it only because I know they do a good job of covering users' butts.

I wouldn't risk any other source!

Mac, but the guy advertising on I think Bonanaza.com, lot good reviews. Answers phone... Not worth a shot? $30!

(then where would you buy after that.. $129 Amazon, which is a tad better than $150 Microsoft)

The Amazon price is close to the best legitimate price that I've seen on the open market....FWIW, my price was under $120.

kevs may be able to do better on eBay, but navigating the options, the "Buy It Now" options in particular, is NOT easy, and an unwary buyer can be mesmerized by price and wind up with a headache.

Microsoft Office Home & Business 2016 for Mac

and

MS Microsoft Office MAC 2016 Home and Business for 1 User 1 Mac

both look good to me, BUT THAT'S ONLY ME.

(As a matter of fact, I'm going to keep an eye on both.)

Mac where did you buy?

You would not buy from Artie's Ebay links correct?

After talking up a $30 option with no real idea of what you'd actually be getting, why are you so quick to talk down sealed Microsoft packaging backed by eBay's Buyer Protection Policy?

Is 2016 software still sealed? Isn't all downloads now?

What all think ---legit?

Can't it be Chinese counterfeit?

Apparently Artie and I are dealing in 2 very different marketplaces.....he's advocating the auction / bidding process on eBay and I'm advocating dealing with a retail discount through a more established retail marketplace. Both will work for an end-user, but the auction process has more moving pieces....the $30 price cited above was the OPENING BID price in an auction that has now seen the price rise to close to double, and there remains lots of time before the auction closes, so that price will continue to rise as bidding continues.

I shopped and compared online at Amazon, Fry's Electronics, NewEgg, BD Photo, Best Buy, Walmart, etc in order to find the most reasonable price for ease of purchase now rather than working the auction timing on eBay.

If you have the time and patience and understanding of the process, eBay can provide many bargains and I have shopped there a lot in the past.....for this particular need, I chose otherwise.

I’m currently using 2011 and was pleased that it continued to work with my upgrade to Sierra. However, it’s silly to think that will go on forever, so I’m thinking I’ll get on the 64 bit horse sooner rather than later.

At the Microsoft site I did see one disconcerting statement:

“Office 2016 suites, including Office Home & Student and Home & Business, include applications such as Word, Excel, PowerPoint, and OneNote; they are available as a one-time purchase for use on a single PC or Mac. The applications are not automatically updated; to get the latest version, you must purchase Office again when the new version becomes available.”

Am I safe to assume “latest version” does not mean the regular updates for improvements or security?

Lacking the clarity which Microsoft usually provides, I would read it literally, namely that Microsoft is going to try to squeeze blood from as many stones as possible (ie, all updates would require repurchase of the suite) — after all, Bill Gates needs a raise.

Given earlier discussion in this thread, I figure that we have a good 5-6 years of being able to use Office for the Mac 2011 before our desire to upgrade our macOSes to 64-bit-only versions. At that point there may be alternatives to Office for the 2016 or its successor which are more viable.

Not to just brush off kevs's Bonanza.com find, I took a look and found $40 (not $30) offerings that actually look kosher on the surface: they email you a key that they say enables you to d/l directly from Microsoft.

But even accepting those offerings at face value, I like "hard" media (I paid $10 for a TechTool Pro disc. ), so I'd opt to pay more for Microsoft packaging on eBay, and with an 18 month window I'm under no pressure to buy now and pay more for the privilege, and can watch and wait.

One of the things I love about eBay is that my time v reward factor is very favorable. YAY!

Ya takes yer choice, and ya pays yer money.

I'll guess that ryck's quote means that subscribers will be upgraded to newer versions of Office as part of their subscriptions whereas purchasers will have to, well, purchase them...same as now...nothing new.

I can't see Microsoft charging for incremental updates which are traditionally free.

As for how long you can run Office 11? How long did you run OS 9?

Rick wrote,

"The applications are not automatically updated; to get the latest version, you must purchase Office again when the new version becomes available.”

Joe you want to pipe in?

I'm assuming, as Artie is noting, I think, that they are saying you are with 2016 and that's it.. now that we live in the world of subscription/ leasing, where people are getting used to the new wham bam wiz features daily.

And this is fine for me and Rick. We don't care we have 2016 in 6-7 years. As long as it keeps working right? Then other issue of updating, whatever gets updated over the months years, as I've been seeing for 2011. What are those updates? Just little trinkets or security things? Those continue? And if not does it matter?

Thanks Mac, will probably take your advice and buy from the legit retail outlets.. otherwise, it 40% chance bogus...

That would be my assumption too, given the history of getting updates automatically, except the words are very specific "....applications are not automatically updated".

I wonder what MacManiac's experience has been with 2016......getting the security and other updates automatically?

Or if Joe jumps back in he might have an opinon...

BTW do any of you use Quicken? I'm on Quicken Mac 2007, and they say the last pre subsciption is 2017, but I can't find a place that sells it.

Except, considering what artie said earlier, that could mean sacrificing the ability to update our system software which, given various security issues, might not be wise.


My other concern would be if they stop publishing 2016 and it becomes difficult to acquire (like keys' Quicken in the post above), which is a key in my thinking about 'getting with 64 bit' now rather than later.

Ryck, Office 2016 is 64 bit no?

And you are saying, for next 5-6 years, it could have security issues for the Mac OS if Microsoft drops the ball and does not send the usual updates we have been getting over the years with 2011?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1266124-REG/microsoft_gza_00850_office_home_student.html

Specs, don't talk about 32 bit 64 bit... whereas with Widows specs they do... are we all sure this is an issue.. that Mac will need 64 bit?

I believe so, as I haven't heard otherwise in this thread.


This is what I'm thinking:

• We have come to the end of updates for 2011 so we'd have to rely on 2016 to maintain security and/or other improvements.

• Microsoft's words inject some doubt about getting the 2016 updates without a cost. I hear what artie is saying about the assumption that updates should be provided as usual. Maybe I've been involved with various versions of contract language too long but I've always found: "The words matter".

• If updates have a cost, it wouldn't be Microsoft "dropping the ball" but rather enhancing their bottom line as grelber earlier opined. And, if that's the case, it may or may not be an issue if the charge is small.

Kevs,

Please contact me: ****pndrgnsvc))))AT//aoldotcom I may be able to help with your Quicken 2017 issue.

Ok but BH photo does not list it as 64 bit.

Anyone on this thread own Mac Office 2016, and/ or Quicken 2017 and can verify they are 64 bit? Thanks

Thanks Harv, sent email.. check spam to be safe, appreciate it.

Microsoft themselves say that they transitioned Office 2016 to 64 bit last year (August), by version 15.25, for all license types.

Thanks U for that confirmation. Ok probably going roll with Amazon (BH photo would be my 2nd choice, but I think Amazon is a even a tad better with refund issues)

No better rate I've found $129.00 anyone else ?

And U or others, have an opinion on Ryck's concerns on them updating over the years 2016? Would you not buy this per that issue?

On my Apple iMac DV SE G3 I ran OS 9 from 2000 to 2011 (and then until mid-2017 when I finally recycled it).
I used OS 9 on other (institutional) Macs for a while before that (ie, since its inception).
So I'm good to squeeze out however much time I might have with El Capitan and perforce Office for the Mac 2011.

Have you got a source for that "40% chance bogus"?

I won't even begin to try to convince you that there's no bootleg Office 2016 on eBay, because I know for a fact that there is (I also know that a lot of people have bought it and been happy with it, i.e. the price, because it's apparently fully functional, albeit illegitimate.), but I've had experience with eBay, Office 2011 in particular, and if what you get is not what was described in the listing, they cover you.

I think that addresses your concerns. (Just plain lousy nomenclature on Microsoft's part.)

You've already posted "The applications are not automatically updated; to get the latest version, you must purchase Office again when the new version becomes available."

That's NOT a small charge!

Nah, I'll stick with my guess. (Again, just plain lousy nomenclature on Microsoft's part.)

Again from my experience in Microsoft Tech Support: illegitimate versions of Microsoft products, are never eligible for upgrade pricing. With the rental pricing model the update/upgrade line gets blurred beyond recognition because version upgrades are considered an update the previous version. It is how Microsoft makes software rental attractive to corporate IT and accounting departments and thereby maintain their cashflow.

You're out of context.

ryck was wondering about Microsoft's language that suggests that legitimate purchasers of the Office 2016 suite will be charged for updates as well as upgrades.

Joe, the final question is: I one buys Office 2016 Mac, will they do the little tiny upgrades over the years as they have been doing for version 2011?

Microsoft spends an inordinate amount of money supporting older software versions. Long term support for older versions of software was assured because the business community was heavily invested in them and understandably reluctant to spend money on upgrades. If Microsoft has been sufficiently successful in moving corporate customers (by far their biggest cash cow) to a rental model they might decide to phase out support of the older stand alone versions in order to move the consumer base to rental or on-line products, thereby reducing Microsoft's costs and significantly improving the bottom line as well as assuring even greater locked in cash flow.

As with all such questions, only those in the front office at Redmond, Washington know the answer to your question with any degree of certainty.

Pulling all the pieces together here, kevs's anxiety relates relates back to ryck's quoted


and while I could maybe see Microsoft charging for incremental security and other updates to the Office 2016 suite (They've already stopped supporting earlier stand alone versions.), it doesn't seem likely that they'd require a new $130 purchase for each one.


taken together with your "With the rental pricing model the update/upgrade line gets blurred beyond recognition because version upgrades are considered an update the previous version" sure sounds like Microsoft's copywriters have tripped over that blurred line and conveyed the erroneous impression that incremental security and other updates to Office 2016 will be treated as if they're functionality upgrades cum dates.

But as you said, "As with all such questions, only those in the front office at Redmond, Washington know the answer to your question with any degree of certainty."

Personally, though, I'll bet against kevs's fears if the price is right.

I'm thinking of doing Amazon's $129 for Office 2016, unless someone advises against it...

I think that finally puts ryck's "updates" issue to rest.

Joe , Ryck etc

Do upgrades matter? I have copy of Dreamweaver 10 years old, they don't upgrade anything at all and I'm fine with it.

Are you taking about upGRADES or upDATES? I guarantee there were a number of upDATES to Dreamweaver, but it long ago dropped off of the support queue. To get upDATES for your Dreamweaver you would have to have purchased an later upGRADE version and there have been several since your version shipped..

upDATES generally offer…

• ...bug fixes
• ...security patches
• ...are free

upGRADES generally offer...

• …new features, some you may never use and some you may find invaluable
• …compatibility with evolving standards (for example there is a lot of new stuff in HTML, CSS, Javascript, graphics, etc. that are not supported in your ten year old Dreamweaver and still other features that have been deprecated or removed from the. standards.)
• …compatibility with newer versions of MacOS (for example your 10 year old Dreamweaver is likely 32 bit and will not be able to run in MacOS 10.13 or 10.14).
• …built in protection from the latest generation Malware exploits.
• …are NOT free but there are discounts if you are upGRADING from a recent version of the product.

Going back to your Dreamweaver example, If your website development needs are modest, and having a modern looking website with the latest features is not a concern, you can stick with your 10 year old Dreamweaver until it is broken by a MacOS upGRADE and it would be okay. With MS Office products their vulnerability to malware exploits would give one pause if for example there sere no security upDATES.

Thanks So much Joe. So you say buy/ don't buy Office 2016?

I really did not want to spend the $80 year just to use Excel/ Word... but.....(subscription)

Hoping to buy 2016.. and use that for 5-10 years....

Do you have an opinion? You don't use Word/ Excel?

What I am saying is the decision must be yours. You have to balance the cost/benefit/risk equation for yourself. I do think your ten year window may be unrealistic given the rate of technological advance but it will likely be good for another five years whether or not Microsoft continues to support it.

I don't use Microsoft Office instead I find Numbers easily fills all my rather pedestrian spreadsheet needs and has the advantage of being free and available on MacOS, iOS, and iCloud and can read and export Excel files. For word processing I occasionally use Pages because it is also free and available on MacOS, iOS, and iCloud but I often find it pretty limiting. For serious writing I use Mellel 4.1 which, in spite of its strong academic orientation, I find to be cleaner, easier to use, and in many ways more powerful than Word. To top it off Mellel 4.1 can read and export Word files. I used to use NeoOffice for all Office tasks but I find it as clunky as Word so now the only thing I use it for is database (which requires Java and is therefore not available in the App Store version. ) For major writing projects for print, the web, eBooks, or a combination of all of the above my choice is Scriviner.

By-the-way in light of your Dreamweaver example, I wish I thought I could afford a new copy of it, but I don't do enough website work to make it a wise investment and I don't want to get stuck paying Adobe for it forever.

Thanks Joe, interesting, I don't see Numbers or Pages in my App folder, so I'll download to take a peek, but I'm so used to excel/ word.

NeoOffice, any better than Openoffice? A few interns have used open office.

Dreamweaver, someone (a tad incoherent), on DW forum mentioned idea of still using my old great copy of DW on a virtual machine. Do you think that would be practical?

(what would that be a Mac virtual machine that will run 32 bit apps?)

Still leaning then toward getting that final standalone copy of office 2016

However ... if one only uses the product offline, it seems to me that this would be a non-issue. Moreover, running a malware-detection and cleaning package such as Malwarebytes from time to time should keep the MS Office suite clean; and running such on any incoming MS Office items should again be protective.
* Please correct any misconception(s) I might have in this regard. *

thanks G

All you have to do is open one infected document in Word or Excel, then the question is whether it can infect your Mac or not. There have been some nasty exploits written in Word Basic (or whatever it is called these days). So far Macs have been spared, but I would not want to be the first one bitten.

But Joe, even with my current 2011 which has security update, I'm not supposed to open emails docs, I'm not sure where came from..?

True all around.
That's one reason I never open Word documents from anyone I don't feel is security-minded. That's also why any (usually long) Word documents I create and wish to share with others I first convert to PDF and send that file instead. (They can convert it back to Word, if they wish, at their end.)

How do you convert a PDF back to Word?

Open in Adobe Reader, then choose Convert to Word online [see toolbar]. Also works for Excel. [It costs.]
In Adobe Acrobat the conversion possibility is part of the app.

Useful info; thanks. (I've never needed anything more than Preview.)

Isn't Reader free and Acrobat the shareware version?

Reader is the free version (which is why there are a lot of things you can't do with it compared with Acrobat).

I'm not aware that Acrobat has a shareware version. One pays up front for a given version (which then includes various updates).

Thanks.

I was confused by "Open in Adobe Reader.... [It costs.]" which implies that it's not free.


I meant to say "commercial" but lost the word. (On the other hand, the difference between the two is often blurred.)

Apropos of your mention of "Chinese counterfeits" a few posts back, there's a guy who has sold 1,100 bootleg copies of Office 2016 Home & Business on eBay. If I remember correctly, they're on disc, and obviously bootleg, but I guess the price (which I forgot to note and can no longer find) was irresistible. (There are also guys selling obviously bootleg copies on thumb drives.)

The day you first posted, though, I didn't look on eBay and missed a legitimate copy of H & B for $55, but I've since decided to forego this golden opportunity to spend the next 1 1/2 years neurotically obsessing over an inconsequential amount of money and paid $90 for it.

Mea culpa. I should have avoided the shorthand and noted that when you select Convert to Word online, it takes you to a pricing page (before conversion). That's one of the reasons Acrobat is a better deal in the long run.

Thanks for the clarification.

And just as useful is your reminder about the utility of Preview, which is at least as good as Adobe Reader for PDF files. I never got into the habit of using Preview for other than viewing JPGs and such (which would just open automatically in that app). I may have to revise my habits.

At one time NeoOffice had a much better user interface than OpenOffice. But then OpenOffice made some major changes to their user interface. After that, I didn't see any significant difference between the two. I stopped upgrading NeoOffice after they started charging for upgrades (and OpenOffice/LibreOffice remained free). The cost of NeoOffice is only $15, but it annoys me that there's no way to try it beforehand to see if it's really any better than OpenOffice/LibreOffice. So, I'm now using LibreOffice 5 (after Oracle's takeover of Sun made OpenOffice's future uncertain). Actually, I alternate between Apple's Pages app and LibreOffice for word processing, but use LibreOffice exclusively for spreadsheets. I find that Apple's Numbers app is like the dumb blond of spreadsheets; looks pretty, but useless for anything more complicated than adding a column of numbers.

I certainly wouldn't spend any significant amount of money to get MS Office.

FYI: The current version of NeoOffice uses the LibreOffice code base, not OpenOffice. NeoOffice's contribution is to encapsulate the LibreOffice code in a Cocoa wrapper and provide full access to all the MacOS features and functions. Because Apple proscribes the use of Java for App Store release that version of NeoOffice has a very anemic database functionality. The non-app store version on the other hand has a very robust miniSQL database function together with ODBC and SQL compatibility.