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#46130 - 09/01/17 03:11 PM Storing imporant credit card into while traveling.
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
I was just abroad and an ATM, would not return my card, and then Citi wanted the card number to log in, which I did not have.

I did not want to travel around with hardcopy paper backups of the numbers. Any tips on how to travel around, yet have access to those card number from a computer if need be?

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#46131 - 09/01/17 04:23 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: kevs
I did not want to travel around with hardcopy paper backups of the numbers.

Why not?! I always travel with a card (about the size of a credit card, cut from a 3x5 card) containing important numbers (credit cards, frequent flyer programs, other important documents) just to be on the safe side. Sometimes I carry 2 copies of such in different locations to be on an even safer side. (If there are passwords/PINs associated with any of those items, then I just have to trust my memory.)

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#46132 - 09/01/17 04:55 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: grelber]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
I carry 2 copies of Passport and DL, but not cards/ passwords.
If you have full card written down then someone can use it.


Edited by kevs (09/01/17 04:55 PM)

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#46133 - 09/01/17 06:15 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: kevs
I carry 2 copies of Passport and DL, but not cards/ passwords.
If you have full card written down then someone can use it.

Two passports? How'd you pull that one off?

If you search, you'll find any number of 3rd party apps that enable you to encrypt a folder, but you can do the job yourself by using Disk Utility to create an encrypted disk image; you can stash a Text Edit doc with your numbers, passwords, etc. inside either encrypted option.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#46134 - 09/01/17 10:49 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
Urquhart Offline


Registered: 08/10/17
Loc: Netherlands
If you want to consider a technological solution: there are many ‘vault’-like apps for the iPhone that store photos, notes, etc. behind a lock (password, swipe pattern, fingerprint, facial recognition). Some even look like a calculator app, so even their presence is obfuscated.

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#46145 - 09/02/17 11:51 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: Urquhart]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
I don't bring my iphone, the idea is a place you could store a file in apples icloud.

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#46146 - 09/02/17 01:05 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
You can access files in your iCloud account from any internet device, so it would be possible to store the card data or images as text or perhaps jpeg files and access them that way. However that would not be particularly secure unless the data were encrypted and then you are back to having to have specific applications installed on any machine you want to access the data from. Both 1Password and Evernote would work but, you might have to install the app and purchase a license to use it on a foreign machine.

Given most airlines now accept boarding passes on smart phones, is strong reason for traveling with your iPhone along with secure access to Apple Pay, PayPal, and your credit card data or images.
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#46149 - 09/02/17 03:20 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: joemikeb]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
Ok Joe, thanks, well, I'll just make disk image on the laptop and put a word file in there; but what if the laptop gets stolen/ lost?

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#46150 - 09/02/17 03:26 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: kevs
Ok Joe, thanks, well, I'll just make disk image on the laptop and put a word file in there; but what if the laptop gets stolen/ lost?

That's why you ENCRYPT the disk image...just another step in the same procedure. (The disk image is a wasted step without the encryption.)
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#46154 - 09/03/17 07:57 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: artie505]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
Yes that disk image on desktop will be encrypted, but what if laptop gets lost?

Is there a quick place in cloud that in encrypted I can keep numbers?

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#46155 - 09/03/17 08:21 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
If your password is strong enough, it won't matter if you lose the laptop. (The disk image doesn't have to be on your desktop; you can hide it somewhere deep in the OS.)

If there's a cloud-based solution for you, I don't have enough knowledge to even begin to guess what it may be.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#46156 - 09/03/17 09:34 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
If a technological solution to a simple problem is so complex to implement, why would one not go back to basics* (eg, see my earlier comments in this thread)?!

* That's one of the reasons I don't have a smartphone — I don't understand them (not for the lack of trying) and the pricing structure of using them is completely opaque to me and service providers cannot (or will not) provide any real insight into their price plans.

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#46157 - 09/03/17 03:14 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
As kevs said, if somebody gets hold of your piece of paper they can use your credit card numbers, and although embedded chips may be somewhat of a deterrent, not all cards have chips as of today's date, and the Internet doesn't always require a physical card.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#46158 - 09/03/17 03:25 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
As kevs said, if somebody gets hold of your piece of paper they can use your credit card numbers, and although embedded chips may be somewhat of a deterrent, not all cards have chips as of today's date, and the Internet doesn't always require a physical card.

Mine are chipped and I keep the security codes separate. On top of that fraudulently used and stolen cards are covered on my home insurance, as well as by the credit card companies. So I'm covered every which way from Sunday.
I'd be surprised if those avenues of recourse weren't available to you guys.

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#46161 - 09/04/17 07:30 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: grelber]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: grelber
Mine are chipped and I keep the security codes separate. On top of that fraudulently used and stolen cards are covered on my home insurance, as well as by the credit card companies. So I'm covered every which way from Sunday.
I'd be surprised if those avenues of recourse weren't available to you guys.

I am not aware of any way that chips can be used for internet transactions and a huge percentage of fraudulent transactions are conducted over the internet with only the credit card number, expiration date, and in some cases the security number. That way no one knows what the perpetrator looks like or has a sample of their handwriting. Additionally, given the card number the rest can be counterfeited — at least enough to get by most checkout clerks.

On this side of the border credit card losses are limited to $50 by federal statute, but even with that and insurance, loss recovery can take months, even years and often is incomplete. There are also time limits on reporting losses and smart criminals often bleed you out in small amounts that you do not notice or overlook on your bill and by the time you realize you are being defrauded it is too late to be covered. Debit card losses are not protected and can easily exceed your net worth.

What isn't covered in your scenario is the use of the information to take out additional credit cards in your name, mortgage loans on your home or business, etc. Yes there is insurance for that, but it is expensive, their track record is spotty, and there again recovery can take a long time. You probably are not as well covered as you think you are.
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#46162 - 09/04/17 07:42 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: kevs
I don't bring my iphone, the idea is a place you could store a file in apples icloud.

You can log into iCloud or Dropbox (if you have an account) from any computer in the world. I don't know if iCloud encrypts data, but Dropbox does. Just save a document to one of those places. Then you only need to worry about the security of public computers while you are logging in. wink
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#46166 - 09/04/17 08:14 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: Ira L]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
This Apple Support Article outlines Apple's online data protection and encryption. This arsTechnica article covers iCloud data encryption and concludes:
Originally Posted By: arsTechnica
The simple answer is that your data is at least as safe as it is when stored on any remote server, if not more so. All data is transferred to computers and mobile devices using secure sockets layer via WebDAV, IMAP, or HTTP. All data except e-mail and notes—more on that later—are stored and encrypted on disk on Apple's servers. And secure authentication tokens are created on mobile devices to retrieve information without constantly transmitting a password.
which is better than I thought and makes me feel a lot better about my data from an APFS (Encrypted) drive that is mirrored on iCloud.

That said, I will continue to keep passwords, credit card and financial information, etc. in 1Password and/or Evernote for their additional layers of encryption, because these applications run on both MacOS and iOS devices. While I cannot access that from a public computer, I always have my MBP, iPad, or iPhone with me. If I traveled internationally and especially in the third world I might have to rethink the availability of my backup data.
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#46168 - 09/04/17 08:44 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: joemikeb]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
I am not aware of any way that chips can be used for internet transactions and a huge percentage of fraudulent transactions are conducted over the internet with only the credit card number, expiration date, and in some cases the security number. That way no one knows what the perpetrator looks like or has a sample of their handwriting. Additionally, given the card number the rest can be counterfeited — at least enough to get by most checkout clerks.

On this side of the border credit card losses are limited to $50 by federal statute, but even with that and insurance, loss recovery can take months, even years and often is incomplete. There are also time limits on reporting losses and smart criminals often bleed you out in small amounts that you do not notice or overlook on your bill and by the time you realize you are being defrauded it is too late to be covered. Debit card losses are not protected and can easily exceed your net worth.

What isn't covered in your scenario is the use of the information to take out additional credit cards in your name, mortgage loans on your home or business, etc. Yes there is insurance for that, but it is expensive, their track record is spotty, and there again recovery can take a long time. You probably are not as well covered as you think you are.

All that may be true below the 49th or maybe just in Texas (eg, flood damage to belongings is not covered unless you've tacked on flood damage coverage to your policy), but insurance coverage north of the 49th is generally a lot more comprehensive: Loss recovery on my credit cards is relatively immediate, identity theft and its sequelae are covered — all on my home insurance; disputed amounts on credit cards are immediately 'frozen' when reported, both here and in the USA, so one is immediately protected (assuming that one is judicious and checks credit cards accounts on some sort of regular basis).

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#46171 - 09/04/17 10:10 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: grelber]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: grelber
All that may be true below the 49th or maybe just in Texas (eg, flood damage to belongings is not covered unless you've tacked on flood damage coverage to your policy), but insurance coverage north of the 49th is generally a lot more comprehensive: Loss recovery on my credit cards is relatively immediate, identity theft and its sequelae are covered — all on my home insurance.

FYI since 1968 in Texas, the other 49 states, and U.S. territorial possessions flood insurance is required for mortgaged properties in flood prone areas and is only available from the National Flood Insurance Program administered through FEMA although it is purchased through commercial insurance companies and agencies. Houston and the surrounding towns were hit by a rain that exceeded the 1,000 year flood plain and many of the flooded homes were meters above the 100 year flood plain. The land there is essentially flat with virtually zero slope and storm drains, creeks, roads, lawns, etc. did not have enough slope or capacity to carry the runoff so the water backed up and literally climbed the few low hills in town. Because of previous flooding from hurricanes the NFIP rates are very high and unaffordable for economically disadvantaged residents. Many far more affluent homes that have never before been even close to being threatened with flooding had water rising to the second floor. But because they thought they were "safe" their owners saw no benefit in flood insurance and didn't buy any.

To put icing on Houston's bitter cake, the President's proposed budget slashes FEMA funding, and if the budget passes it may be several years before FEMA will have funds to pay out Houston's flood insurance claims. They are still paying claims from Hurricane Katrina that hit New Orleans in 2005.

The current trend is to buy out flood prone areas rather than permitting rebuilding, but in Houston's case, how would anyone go about buying out most of the sixth largest city in the United States (some 4.65 million people), including a major portion of the nations petrochemical industry, and one of the largest seaports? On the other hand, as the sea level rise from glacial melt continues, and the number and strengths of tropical cyclones increases due to global warming, there may be no other viable long term option.
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#46172 - 09/04/17 10:31 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: joemikeb]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Great info. Thanks for capsulizing it.

In this neck of the woods/prairies we're getting far too many floodings from weather phenomena, such that building codes are now gearing up for so-called 1-in-1000-year rains, meaning that location (house-siting) must conform to new criteria relating to proximity to water bodies, slope of site, etc. Insurance on non-conforming properties (including those already extant) becomes problematic — not to put too fine a point on it.

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#46173 - 09/04/17 02:45 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: grelber]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
Thanks all, yes I just went to SE ASia.. So maybe dropbox? Though honestly dropbox is just barely workable from US. It's very clunky and buggy... but I could keep that in mind.

But I can log into icloud very well and consistently. Can I encrypt a note or something in icloud?

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#46174 - 09/04/17 03:47 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
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#46175 - 09/04/17 03:56 PM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: joemikeb]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
Joe, thanks, cool, but let's say I make a note in notes with credit card numbers. Then that note is on my desktop/ laptop, and the thief who steals the desktop or laptop will see the note right? Unless there a way to just have a note show in icloud.com?

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#46182 - 09/05/17 06:41 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: kevs]
Virtual1 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Iowa
I like the idea of an encrypted disk image also. Storing that on iCloud or Dropbox would make a good mobile solution, so long as you knew you were (A) going to have internet access and (B) knew you were going to have a computer that could open the disk image.

Though both keep a cached copy, making continuous internet access non-essential.
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#46183 - 09/05/17 09:02 AM Re: Storing imporant credit card into while traveling. [Re: Virtual1]
kevs Offline


Registered: 12/07/09
Still my question: for all:

cool, but let's say I make a note in notes with credit card numbers. Then that note is on my desktop/ laptop, and the thief who steals the desktop or laptop will see the note right? Unless there a way to just have a note show in icloud.com?

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