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#45344 - 06/24/17 08:37 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
The handwriting is on the wall for 32 bit apps, but the exact timeline for its demise hasn't been explicitly defined yet.

It has nothing specific to do with APFS.
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#45347 - 06/24/17 08:47 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: artie505]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Not to put too fine point on it, Artie, I take it that 32 bit apps will continue to work with High Sierra & APFS- at least until Apple throws the switch. And when that is, remains TBD. Or am I missing something?
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27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

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#45348 - 06/24/17 09:03 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
32 bit apps are supposed to work in High Sierra, with or without APFS, Harv; Apple is going to begin pulling the plug on them - no specifics about that yet - in the macOS iteration that follows High Sierra and complete the job in the next one.


Edited by artie505 (06/24/17 09:06 AM)
Edit Reason: Qualification
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#45350 - 06/24/17 09:16 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
joemikeb Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: Pendragon
Is the 64 bit requirement linked/tied to APFS, or is it that both of these are merely being rolled out with High Sierra? confused

Shear coinicidence. APFS was a non-option install with iOS 10.3 but the 32 bit app exclusion doesn't kick in until iOS 11. By-the-way Apple is purging the App Store of all iOS and MacOS 32 bit apps.


Edited by joemikeb (06/24/17 09:18 AM)
Edit Reason: apparently I can't spell MacOS
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#45352 - 06/24/17 09:28 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Edit Reason: apparently I can't spell MacOS

The correct spelling is macOS, regardless of what spell-check thinks.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#45433 - 06/28/17 08:17 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
jchuzi Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: New York State
Originally Posted By: Pendragon
Gads! Not having a bootable backup is a bit (a big bit) of a game changer for me, e.g., I may delay updating to High Sierra until Carbon Copy Cloner (or SD!) gets theses issues resolved.
Carbon Copy Cloner 4.1.16 has just been released. "[New] Adds preliminary support for cloning from an APFS startup volume to an HFS+ backup volume (applicable only to macOS 10.13 High Sierra). "
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OS 10.14.5, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

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#45442 - 06/28/17 10:56 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: jchuzi]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Clearly I'm confused:

I. After Carbon Copy Cloner copies an APFS volume to an HFS+ volume, what happens were one to copy that volume back to the original APFS volume. Would it remain APFS or will it revert to being an HFS+ volume?

2. Or, to put it another way: After Carbon Copy Cloner copies an APFS volume to an HFS+ volume, does the newly copied volume remain HFS+ or does it become APFS?
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#45443 - 06/28/17 11:47 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
jchuzi Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: New York State
DIIK (Damned if I know)! blush
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Jon

OS 10.14.5, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

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#45444 - 06/28/17 12:46 PM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
joemikeb Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: Pendragon
Clearly I'm confused:

I. After Carbon Copy Cloner copies an APFS volume to an HFS+ volume, what happens were one to copy that volume back to the original APFS volume. Would it remain APFS or will it revert to being an HFS+ volume?

2. Or, to put it another way: After Carbon Copy Cloner copies an APFS volume to an HFS+ volume, does the newly copied volume remain HFS+ or does it become APFS?

If I read correctly cloning a APFS volume to an HFS+ drive does NOT change the volume structure if the target drive ie. the target drive remains HFS+. Neither does it clone the two or three other hidden volumes present on the APFS drive at this time. That will take a significant amount of additional engineering to accomplish. The CCC clone is file by file not sector by sector.

Other than the Recovery Volume, I have no idea what the function of the other hidden volumes on an APFS drive are and no idea what the effect of cloning back from an HFS+ Drive to an APFS volume would do.

My question to you is why not format both the source and target volumes APFS or clone to a sparseimage file formatted APFS (realizing the sparseimage would not be bootable)? Why do you want to cling to an HFS+ formatted drive or volume? There is a lot of new functionality in APFS that High Sierra and its successors will take advantage of that are simply not possible on an HFS+ volume.
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#45446 - 06/28/17 01:29 PM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: joemikeb]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
[quote=Pendragon]
My question to you is why not format both the source and target volumes APFS or clone to a sparseimage file formatted APFS (realizing the sparseimage would not be bootable)? Why do you want to cling to an HFS+ formatted drive or volume


At one time, I thought I may need an HFS+ volume, but have since come to the realization that keeping such just makes matters worse when the time comes that I must convert/transition to APFS.

That all said, do you think it makes any difference if I first erase the HFS+ target volume and then clone from 10.13 to HFS+ volume, or merely reinstall 10.13?
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#45447 - 06/28/17 02:24 PM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: joemikeb]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
My question to you is why not format both the source and target volumes APFS or clone to a sparseimage file formatted APFS (realizing the sparseimage would not be bootable)?

Didn't the cart just got ahead of the horse? We had been discussing what to do until CCC is capable of cloning one APFS volume to another APFS volume.

Once CCC is up to speed, Harv's question will be pointless unless he's got some specific reason for perpetuating an HFS+ volume.
_________________________
The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory Of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#45606 - 07/08/17 05:05 AM Re: APFS & High Sierra [Re: Pendragon]
joemikeb Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: Pendragon
That all said, do you think it makes any difference if I first erase the HFS+ target volume and then clone from 10.13 to HFS+ volume, or merely reinstall 10.13?
From what I have seen I don't think it would make any difference whatsoever in the final outcome. The High Sierra installer does its own thing on the boot drive much of which appears unique to that drive.
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