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#34183 - 05/11/15 02:22 AM How to name photos
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
In Photos, how does one name a particular photo? I do not want the meta data or to overlay the photo, just a simple custom title below the photo.

I have been unsuccessful in resolving this issue even though it seems it should be an easy task. What am I missing, or do I need some third party app, if so,have you suggestions?
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#34184 - 05/11/15 04:34 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Pendragon]
Virtual1 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Iowa
I don't have photos up on this machine with any pictures so I can't test it, but I'd assume you would just click on the name of the photo, maybe wait a sec and click on it again, and it would become editable? or right-click and select Rename?
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#34189 - 05/11/15 05:38 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Virtual1]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: Virtual1
I don't have photos up on this machine with any pictures so I can't test it, but I'd assume you would just click on the name of the photo, maybe wait a sec and click on it again, and it would become editable? or right-click and select Rename?


That's the rub. On iOS there's nothing to click on, no name, no nada-
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#34192 - 05/11/15 07:46 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Pendragon]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Good question Harv. Unfortunately the Help and other documentation for Photos is pretty sketchy. I have looked everywhere I can think of and unlike its predecessors — iPhoto and Aperture — Photos does not appear to have any facility for naming an image. In fact the names that were assigned to images in iPhoto and Aperture appear to have been lost in the conversion to Photos. IMHO a very real loss in functionality and flexibility that I had not previously noticed. frown mad

I have taken advantage of being an OS X 10.10.4 public beta tester to use Apple's Feedback Assistant app to report this omission in Photos to Apple and I would encourage you to report it in Apple Feedback as well. Interestingly Photos feedback only appears under OS X and is not listed as either an iOS or iCloud app, yet it appears on all three platforms.

By-the-way, when you are talking about Photos and other multi-platform apps, it would be helpful to specify whether it is Photos on OS X 10.10.3, iOS 8.3 on an iPhone, iOS 8.3 on an iPad, or on iCloud. Functionally they should all be the same, but the devil can be in the details.
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#34193 - 05/11/15 09:00 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Pendragon]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
If you want to name a picture in Photos in OS 10.10.3, double-click the desired photo. This should open it as a larger image. The top right of the main Photo application window has now also changed. One of the new buttons, to the left of the now appearing "Edit" button, is an "i" in a circle. Click this and a new window opens in which you can add a title, keywords, faces, etc.

You will also notice that a new sidebar has opened after double-clicking the desired photo. This sidebar shows all photos in the same album or group as the original. You can individually choose these and the "naming window" will change to allow subsequent actions on the other photos. That is, you do not have to go back and double-click other photos to name them.

However, I have not been able to do a batch naming or keyword entry on multiple photos like you could in iPhoto (i.e., by command- or shift-clicking on multiple photos).

In iOS none of the above seems to be possible. Any editing options only seem to impact on cropping, color, tone, etc.
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#34202 - 05/11/15 11:03 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Ira L]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Great information Ira, I had missed that and thought perhaps you had solved the problem.However, while you can assign a title to an image in Photos on OS X, the title is apparently only seen when you open the "get info" window for that image either in Finder or Photos on OS X.


Edited by joemikeb (05/11/15 11:22 AM)
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#34240 - 05/12/15 10:32 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: joemikeb]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Great information Ira, I had missed that and thought perhaps you had solved the problem.However, while you can assign a title to an image in Photos on OS X, the title is apparently only seen when you open the "get info" window for that image either in Finder or Photos on OS X.


I also see the title in Photos on OS X when viewing a screenful of images in an album or "All Photos" or any other Photo application sidebar locations where the photo shows up.
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On a Mac since 1984.
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#34252 - 05/13/15 01:34 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: joemikeb]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Many thanks, mon ami(s).

I'll be patient while awaiting Apple to attend the issue (problem), and in the interim, wonder how Apple allowed this to (even) happen. confused
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#34253 - 05/13/15 06:32 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Pendragon]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
I have not examined the code, but from the way this is working, I would venture on OS X the name, etc. is stored as meta-data in the HFS+ (Mac OS Extended) file system. Given iOS and iCloud do not have an HFS+ file system per se there is no place to store the data on those platforms.

To get all this on iOS and iCoud they might have to reverrt to the older structure where there are two copies of every file one visible file that has the content and a second invisible file that contains the meta-data. More likely they would make each image a package file similar to the practice in Pages and one of the files in the package would contain the meta-data. Of course that would increase complexity and increased complexity almost always results in increased fragility and opportunity for error not to mention file size.
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#34255 - 05/13/15 06:55 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: joemikeb]
Virtual1 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Iowa
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
I have not examined the code, but from the way this is working, I would venture on OS X the name, etc. is stored as meta-data in the HFS+ (Mac OS Extended) file system. Given iOS and iCloud do not have an HFS+ file system per se there is no place to store the data on those platforms.


I would struggle to find a single Apple app nowadays that uses metadata for anything. Finder file flags (colors, locked, etc) are about all I can think of offhand. Metadata of that sort is stored in either EXIF or a format akin to it, as a metadata block at the start or usually the end of the file. EXIF is normally specifically for photos, and stores a myriad of metadata such as exposure settings and pixel density, but also other related metadata such as date/time, GPS location, camera model, etc. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchangeable_image_file_format)

The same type of meta tags can be found in videos found in iTunes. (though the format may not be the same) They store dozens of tags, including information about the movie itself, as well as a lot of data about the purchase made on the app store. (such as the name of the account used to do the purchase) This data can be stripped completely out without impacting the video playback in any way. The same sort of tags exist on the music tracks. The contents of both can be edited to some extent within iTunes. Even album art is stored there within the music tracks.

Apple being Apple, I'd expect iPhoto uses exactly the same meta structures as iTunes, with a data structure tacked onto the end of the file. So it should make the trip across a foreign filesystem that lacks resource forks and extended meta fields in the directory.

xattr is used to edit filesystem-level metadata

AtomicParsley is most commonly used to change metadata on files from the ITMS. (it may work with iPhoto also, I haven't tried it) The -metaenima switch is useful to flush all metadata from a file.
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#34263 - 05/13/15 09:27 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Virtual1]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Good information -- thanks!
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#34309 - 05/15/15 09:23 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Virtual1]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
I did some research and found that in iPhoto Titles, comments, locations, and I believe faces are stored in the iPhoto library database and not in the image file itself. When importing iPhoto libraries into Photos apparently only the images are copied and not the library database and its attendent information. Information on Photos is sketchy so far, but I assume when that data is created in Photos it is stored in the Photos library database as well.

I have not yet been able to determine if the Photos library data is transferred to the iCloud or not. If it is, it does not appear that it works way down to the iOS versions of Photos.

I am still researching this.
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#34314 - 05/16/15 08:02 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: joemikeb]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
I did some research and found that in iPhoto Titles, comments, locations, and I believe faces are stored in the iPhoto library database and not in the image file itself. When importing iPhoto libraries into Photos apparently only the images are copied and not the library database and its attendent information. Information on Photos is sketchy so far, but I assume when that data is created in Photos it is stored in the Photos library database as well.

I have not yet been able to determine if the Photos library data is transferred to the iCloud or not. If it is, it does not appear that it works way down to the iOS versions of Photos.

I am still researching this.


It may get weirder than what you just described.

I looked at some iPhoto—>Photo imports in Photos and keywords are imported, along with the original title from iPhoto, but this title does not show up in the Title field in Photos; that field shows "Add a title". However, if you choose to manually export said photo, like to your Desktop, it appears in its destination with "original title.jpg" showing on the file.

Also, with Export… in Photos you can select to include "Title, Keywords, Description", which is how the original title (at least for me) showed up, even though the Photos Title field was blank. Go figure!
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#34449 - 05/28/15 03:34 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Ira L]
Pendragon Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Evren Carven, at MacRumors, posted the solution. 'Tis a wee bit awkward, but otherwise works:

In Photos-
1. Go to menu: View - Metadata, and enable "Titles".

2. Right click a photo and choose 'Get Info' to add a title for the photo with the "Add a Title" option. You can also add key words and a description.

Indeed I never would have divined the solution/fix... but I should have.
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Harv
27" i7 iMac (10.13.6), iPhone Xs Max (12.1)

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire

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#34458 - 05/28/15 10:08 AM Re: How to name photos [Re: Pendragon]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
Enabling this particular view allows you to title the Photo directly in the "All Photos" view of Photos; it is not necessary to double-click the photo or choose the Info button. That is, hover over the the thumbnail and "Untitled" will show up; click and type.

Pretty cool. All the other suggestions above also work, perhaps with more mouse clicks.
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