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#22603 - 07/21/12 02:41 PM My New MacBook Pro
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
I'm getting used to some stuff but other stuff has me stumped!

Where is my hard drive icon?

Was I supposed to get install disks with my MacBook? I didn't.

confused

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#22604 - 07/21/12 02:53 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
No install disks starting with Lion. Another good reason for Time Machine backups.

In Finder's Preference list you can choose to have your HD icon appear on the Desktop.

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#22605 - 07/21/12 02:55 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: grelber]
alternaut Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
In some Preference list you can choose to have your HD icon appear on the Desktop. I've forgotten where I found it in order to select the option.

The Finder prefs?
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#22606 - 07/21/12 02:57 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: alternaut]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
We nailed it at the same moment! I had just corrected it in my earlier reply.

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#22607 - 07/21/12 03:01 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: alternaut]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
Right. Found it under Finder Prefs. Thanks!!!

Now about the install disks. No more archive and install and all that other stuff we used to be able to do?
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#22608 - 07/21/12 04:27 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
It was unavoidable, Rita, but you've bought yourself a problem in the sense that rather than a disk, Apple has given you a recovery partition that works via the Internet, i.e. if you need to reinstall, you've either got to download, which, with your capped bandwidth is not particularly feasible, or either maintain a more or less current backup, not necessarily Time Machine, or buy a $69 Lion thumb drive.

grelber may be in a worse position than you're in, because he's behind a 56k modem, and the download would take him 9 1/2 days to complete. If my memory serves me, he discussed the issue with Apple and was told that they could maybe arrange a free thumb drive for him. I think he dropped the matter, but I'd love to see someone push them on it, because, in short, Apple has disenfranchised that portion of the world that does not have easy/inexpensive access to broadband (and it's only going to get worse). (Edit: Apple's "user-friendly" suggestion is that you take your Mac either to a friend or relative's home or to work if you don't have broadband at home.)

As for traditional Archive & Install, I don't think that can be done any longer...you can only reinstall the most current version of OS X.

Edit 2: By the way, you ought to run Software Update, because your Safari, at the least, is out of date. (I've got v 5.1.7.)

Edit 3: Your recovery partition perpetuates much of your old install disc's functionality and also adds some new stuff.


Edited by artie505 (07/21/12 04:42 PM)
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#22609 - 07/21/12 04:52 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Mayhap. But go back to the earlier thread "Buying a new laptop" and have a gander at ganbustein's comment (#22585) ... that pretty much covers the problem, far more so than a quickly outdated system on a costly thumb drive.

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#22610 - 07/21/12 04:55 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: artie505]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
Artie:

Not sure what " Your recovery partition perpetuates much of your old install disc's functionality and also adds some new stuff." means. You know me, baby talk. First grader. Even though I've been on computers for quite some time, I've never gone very deeply into them. Just want to do what I want to do.

I am updating all software as we speak but for some reason, Safari was not included. I thought that was odd because I could see it's a little out of date.

I am not quite so limited in my bandwidth now. Instead of satellite, we have a microwave system. Hope that makes sense because I can't explain it. The guy that owns it told me I would not be limited unless I wanted to download a lot of movies or something. Then I was to call him so he could "open up the pipes" so to speak, temporarily. It's faster than satellite but slower than high speed internet. Thus, I get buffering.

So, would Time Machine be a better deal because of this? I haven't priced the external hard drives yet to be able to use it.

Rita


Edited by plantsower (07/21/12 04:58 PM)
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#22611 - 07/21/12 09:58 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
I'm not running Lion, Rita, and I've never even seen a Lion Recovery HD in action, so I can't offer much insight, but OS X Lion: About Lion Recovery will give you some. (One thing that will be new to you is the ability to repair your home folder's permissions.)

I dunno what's up with your Safari; Apple's Safari 5.1.7 page specifies "System Requirements - OS X Lion 10.7.3."

And, finally, no, your new bandwidth situation in no way affects your use of Time Machine, which has no Internet reliance; it will, however, facilitate an OS X download should a reinstallation become necessary.
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#22612 - 07/21/12 10:24 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Mayhap. But go back to the earlier thread "Buying a new laptop" and have a gander at ganbustein's comment (#22585) ... that pretty much covers the problem, far more so than a quickly outdated system on a costly thumb drive.

Time Machine's value to many users in many situations isn't lost on me, i.e. when you travel with your iMac, you're already traveling so heavy that carrying an external HD is no big deal ( tongue ), but when Joe User goes on the road with his sleek, featherweight MacBook Air and has to carry an external HD instead of a DVD or thumb drive, sleek & light go by the boards.

Apple's having given us Time Machine doesn't negate the fact that an indeterminate percentage of the world's current and potential Mac users, you, as has been already been noted, included, has been disenfranchised and/or inconvenienced and/or forced to spend extra money for something that may, in some circumstances, be considered useless.

Edit: It would be much appreciated if you linked to posts rather than just referenced them. (There's a thread initiated by dkmarsh, my link to which is, unfortunately, damaged, so I can't post it, but maybe dk will, in which he's posted an AppleScript that copies a URL to the clipboard, although you'll sometimes have to substitute post numbers to get it to link to a particular post.)


Edited by artie505 (07/21/12 11:57 PM)
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#22613 - 07/22/12 01:31 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
It would be much appreciated if you linked to posts rather than just referenced them.

I usually do, but I was in a rush and seeing as that thread was originated by plantsower and in her own bailiwick both spatially and temporally in the forums, I went with what was expedient.

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#22614 - 07/22/12 05:11 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: artie505]
joemikeb Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: Artie505
...but when Joe User goes on the road with his sleek, featherweight MacBook Air and has to carry an external HD instead of a DVD or thumb drive, sleek & light go by the boards.

Joe can backup the most critical data files to iCloud and assuming the HD has not failed completely can repair the volume structure on the HD, reinstall Lion (or Mountain Lion) and all the apps purchased through the app store from anywhere there is a high speed internet connection. So when on the road Joe can leave the Time Machine drive behind.
Originally Posted By: Artie505
Apple's having given us Time Machine doesn't negate the fact that an indeterminate percentage of the world's current and potential Mac users, you, as has been already been noted, included, has been disenfranchised and/or inconvenienced and/or forced to spend extra money for something that may, in some circumstances, be considered useless.

I seem to recall that same thing being said when Apple abandoned the floppy disk drive, OS 9, the Motorola 68000 series processors, SCSI, the PowerPC, etc. Unlike Microsoft, Apple has never clung to outdated technologies and Apple users have adapted to the changes. Watch for near future releases without Firewire, SATA, or rotating hard drives. They have to be on the list of soon to be obsolete technologies.
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#22615 - 07/22/12 11:49 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: joemikeb]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: joemikeb

Joe can backup the most critical data files to iCloud and assuming the HD has not failed completely can repair the volume structure on the HD, reinstall Lion (or Mountain Lion) and all the apps purchased through the app store from anywhere there is a high speed internet connection. So when on the road Joe can leave the Time Machine drive behind.


Rita, this is an important statement, but not readily understood if you haven't used the App Store and/or Lion. There is a link in the App Store called "Purchased" and everything you have ever purchased can be downloaded again, for free, to the same computer/Apple ID. This includes Systems, so when you upgrade to Mountain Lion 10.8 (which should be free for you since you just purchased the laptop), that can also be downloaded again. No need for install discs. Yes, the catch is you have to have an Internet connection, but that seems to be the way of the world.

So even if your hard drive dies and you can't access the Recovery partition (automatically created and present on new computers or when you install 10.7 or above) and you are forced to put in a brand new hard drive, many of your apps and System are accessible.

But you should still back up regularly, since not everything you have is covered by the above scenarios.
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#22616 - 07/22/12 12:47 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: Ira L]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
Thanks Ira. Learned something new again. Boy, it's like going from OS9 to OS10. Lots of learn.

I have an email into Other World Computing to see which external drive would be best for Time Machine. Now that I know some of this stuff, I see the need for Time Machine. I would never need to travel with a thumb drive or an external drive. I don't usually take my Mac with me on trips.

Rita

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#22617 - 07/22/12 02:44 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: artie505]
tacit Offline


Registered: 08/03/09
Loc: Portland, Oregon, USA
Originally Posted By: artie505
Apple's having given us Time Machine doesn't negate the fact that an indeterminate percentage of the world's current and potential Mac users, you, as has been already been noted, included, has been disenfranchised and/or inconvenienced and/or forced to spend extra money for something that may, in some circumstances, be considered useless.


I've been a computer owner since 1977, when I got my first Radio Shack TRS-80, and if there's one thing I've learned in that time it's that a backup hard drive is *never* useless.

There are two kinds of computer users in the world: those who have experienced a catastrophic loss of their hard drive, and those who will. Anyone on any computer of any kind whatsoever needs to understand that if your data are important to you, a backup system is not optional. You *will* lose data if you don't have one; it's only a matter of time.

I actually keep two--one that I do frequent backups onto, so that if my hard drive takes a header I'll never lose more than a day or two's work; and one that I do less frequent backups onto, so that if I accidentally delete a critical file and I don't figure it out for a week, I'll still be able to recover it. smile
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#22620 - 07/23/12 07:39 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
Ira L Offline


Registered: 08/13/09
Loc: California
Originally Posted By: plantsower

I have an email into Other World Computing to see which external drive would be best for Time Machine.


What a coincidence. I just did the same and ended up with a "Mercury On-the-Go Pro". This drive has two advantages, from my perspective: 1.) it is USB 3.0 capable, which the new MacBooks can handle, and is quite a fast connection; 2.) it comes with a way cool carrying case that holds the little drive and the USB cable. smirk The whole package is quite small (about 4"x6"x2") and lightweight, so if you had to take it with you, it would not be too much of a burden.
_________________________
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Currently: 27" iMacs, Macbook Air, macOS 10.14.x,; iPhones, iPods and iPads galore!

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#22621 - 07/23/12 08:24 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: Ira L]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
You want portable? You want small? Then, as I noted earlier, check out ...

Western Digital My Passport Essential SE – 1 TB

Interface – USB 3.0 (backward compatible with USB 2.0)

Data transfer rate: Up to 480 Mb/s in USB 2.0 mode or up to 5 Gb/s in USB 3.0 mode

Dimensions –
Height: 0.70 in (18 mm)
Depth: 4.30 in (110 mm)
Width: 3.20 in (83 mm)
Weight: 7.2 oz (200 g)

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#22622 - 07/23/12 08:59 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: Ira L]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
Ira: I looked up what you bought and it was expensive. Is that what I can expect to pay on the average for an external hard drive? I still have to pay for my Apple Care Contract. Boo!!

Rita
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#22623 - 07/23/12 09:07 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: Ira L]
Virtual1 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Iowa
Originally Posted By: Ira L
So even if your hard drive dies and you can't access the Recovery partition (automatically created and present on new computers or when you install 10.7 or above) and you are forced to put in a brand new hard drive, many of your apps and System are accessible.

So when you replace the dead hard drive in your computer with a freshly formatted drive.... you just boot off.... what exactly? to begin the reinstallation process? Unless it can boot off the app store wink
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#22624 - 07/23/12 09:23 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
alternaut Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: plantsower
Is that what I can expect to pay on the average for an external hard drive?

No, check out the OWC Mercury Elite Pro for instance. You can get 3TB for less than $300. The smaller sized drive Ira purchased commands a premium price. Note, however, that most external drives would require something like an Airport Express or Extreme to hook up to for wireless access.
As to drives with multiple port types* like the Elite Pro, I prefer to pay a bit extra for them. Should one konk out, you still have alternative connection options, provided your Mac offers them as well.

*) the OWC Mercury Elite Pro doesn't yet sport a USB-3 port, but that may change before long.
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#22625 - 07/23/12 09:28 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: alternaut]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
$300 is a big deal to me. It kind of makes me angry when I now know that I can't have an install disk, but have to purchase an expensive (a relative term) external drive to be able to protect my stuff. frown

Rita

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#22626 - 07/23/12 10:31 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
alternaut Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
I understand that the extra expense can be a problem. I just wanted to point out that you can get more hard disk space-bang for your buck than with specialized mini-drives for laptops. That said, the 3TB drive I mentioned happens to be the best deal of the series at $92 per TB, even though you might do with a smaller drive. Also note that it may pay to budget for a backup drive etc. when looking for a new computer, especially if your work is worth something to you and any loss could have serious consequences in terms of money or time.
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#22627 - 07/23/12 10:52 AM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: alternaut]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
Thank you. I don't know how much I would need, as I don't really understand the Time Machine, etc. What I do know is that I've had my iBook G4 for a little over six years, and I still have 41 GB of free space out of the 55.7 GB hard drive. Does that give you an idea of what I may need? My usage hasn't increased much since then that I know of.

Rita


Originally Posted By: alternaut
I understand that the extra expense can be a problem. I just wanted to point out that you can get more hard disk space-bang for your buck than specialized mini-drives for laptops. That said, the 3TB drive I mentioned happens to be the best deal of the series at $92 per TB, even though you might do with a smaller drive.
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#22628 - 07/23/12 12:02 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: plantsower]
alternaut Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
To estimate the space needed on a Time Machine drive you could start with the basic OS install you start out with on your Mac, and add to that the data you move to it now plus expect to add later. Since the TM allows you to store multiple versions of whatever you have on your Mac, you'd have to accommodate that too, at least to some extent. You should also know that when a TM drive gets full, TM will start deleting the oldest data to make room for the new.

In summary, the size of a TM hard disk would amount to the used space on your Mac HD you begin with, plus a (judicious) multiple of the space your data takes up (or likely will take up). So, if for example the OS measures 10GB and your data too, you'd need at least 20 GB, but probably more like 40-60GB. As it's getting hard to find HDs smaller than 150GB or so (excluding SSDs), you could start with one of those, and shop around for reliability, price and perhaps variables like multiple port options. As it happens, the price range of such drives start at around $90 (like Ira's choice), so that seems like the bottom line unless you opt for a raw drive mechanism plus dock.
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#22629 - 07/23/12 12:14 PM Re: My New MacBook Pro [Re: alternaut]
plantsower Offline


Registered: 09/13/09
Loc: Burson, CA
I just got an email from Other World Computing which stated:

"You want a drive at least as large or larger than the drive you are going to be using the Time Machine drive for." In my case, I think that's overkill, right? My Macbook holds 500 GB. I didn't quite understand all that you said, but as long as I get an external drive of at least 150 GB, I think I will be safe from what I've deduced. Also, if I get crazy with it, I can always buy a larger capacity hard drive.

Rita


Originally Posted By: alternaut
To estimate the space needed on a Time Machine drive you could start with the basic OS install you start out with on your Mac, and add to that the data you move to it now plus expect to add later. Since the TM allows you to store multiple versions of whatever you have on your Mac, you'd have to accommodate that too, at least to some extent. You should also know that when a TM drive gets full, TM will start deleting the oldest data to make room for the new.

In summary, the size of a TM hard disk would amount to the used space on your Mac HD you begin with, plus a (judicious) multiple of the space your data takes up (or likely will take up). So, if for example the OS measures 10GB and your data too, you'd need at least 20 GB, but probably more like 40-60GB. As it's getting hard to find HDs smaller than 150GB or so (excluding SSDs), you could start with one of those, and shop around for reliability, price and perhaps variables like multiple port options. As it happens, the price range of such drives start at around $90 (like Ira's choice), so that seems like the bottom line unless you opt for a raw drive mechanism plus dock.
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