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#21108 - 03/19/12 02:12 AM Another doomsday prediction
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||

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#21109 - 03/19/12 02:30 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: grelber]
artie505 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
If I can keep my current deuced Mac(hina) running long enough, my next one may be implantable. frown
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#21112 - 03/19/12 07:32 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: grelber]
ryck Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
When it comes to looking to the future, Microsoft may not be the place to seek predictions. I have to think that, as long as there are graphic artists, or people who need to view large spreadsheets, blueprints, et cetera, there will a need for a viewing surface larger than portable devices offer.

And, yes, it can be argued that a person only needs the portable device coupled with a large screen but that's effectively the same thing as occupying the physical space with a desktop computer.

Interestingly, the article mentions: "Microsoft’s biggest problem isn’t any particular flaw in Windows 8, but rather that the operating system itself is less a cohesive unit and more an awkward Frankensteining of two wildly different operating systems."

It appears that Microsoft isn't even able to learn from their own history. When they decided that the Mac operating system was something to emulate they came out with Windows - which was essentially an operating system stuck on top of an older operating system - and we all know how well that worked.


Edited by ryck (03/19/12 07:39 AM)
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#21113 - 03/19/12 07:48 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: ryck]
roger Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Vermont
Originally Posted By: ryck

And, yes, it can be argued that a person only needs the portable device coupled with a large screen but that's effectively the same thing as occupying the physical space with a desktop computer.


but at a savings of many dollars.
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#21114 - 03/19/12 08:07 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: roger]
ryck Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: roger
but at a savings of many dollars.

I suppose....if you're going to own both a laptop and a desktop. And, if you only need the desktop, I'm sure it would be cheaper than a laptop and a screen.


Edited by ryck (03/19/12 08:07 AM)
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#21115 - 03/19/12 08:36 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: ryck]
dkmarsh Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09

Quote:
...they came out with Windows - which was essentially an operating system stuck on top of an older operating system - and we all know how well that worked.

And yet that's exactly what OS X is as well. shocked
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#21118 - 03/19/12 09:32 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: dkmarsh]
ryck Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
I'm not any sort of expert but, just applying my simple-minded logic, it's seems there's a key difference.

The original Mac OS was a "from the ground up" GUI system. Microsoft took a system that was not and plunked something on top in order to emulate the GUI.

The OSX system, while it may be "on top" of the original, is a continuation of a GUI that has solid roots in the first system. N'est-ce pas?

My analogy would be car transmissions. One company decides that people may not want to clutch and shift, and might like "Just put it in D and go." When that becomes popular, the second company instead sticks a transmission on top of their first transmission to pull all the levers. It's sort of works, but not nearly as well as the first company's automatic.

Later the first company thinks that customers might like a three gear automatic rather than the old two gear. So they build on what they have - simply modifying something that has has all the wrinkles ironed out.

The second company continues down its original path.


Edited by ryck (03/19/12 09:35 AM)
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#21119 - 03/19/12 10:16 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: ryck]
roger Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Vermont
Originally Posted By: ryck
Originally Posted By: roger
but at a savings of many dollars.

I suppose....if you're going to own both a laptop and a desktop. And, if you only need the desktop, I'm sure it would be cheaper than a laptop and a screen.


not much, actually. new Macbook Air is $949, a new iMac is $1149. you can get a good, large monitor for $200.
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#21121 - 03/19/12 10:41 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: ryck]
dkmarsh Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09

I was referring to Mac OS X being a GUI running on top of a UNIX-based operating system, not unlike Windows being a GUI running on top of DOS.
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#21123 - 03/19/12 12:02 PM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: dkmarsh]
ryck Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Ah...perhaps my turn to blush. I had always thought of OSX as being the existing "ground up" GUI with Unix added (the two gear to three gear analogy).
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#21124 - 03/19/12 12:15 PM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: roger]
ryck Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: roger
not much, actually. new Macbook Air is $949, a new iMac is $1149. you can get a good, large monitor for $200.

But isn't that an apple and an orange? The basic MacBook Air and the basic iMac are quite different in terms of memory, storage, processor, et cetera. What's the cost of the equivalent MacBook Air?
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#21126 - 03/19/12 03:15 PM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: dkmarsh]
joemikeb Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: dkmarsh

I was referring to Mac OS X being a GUI running on top of a UNIX-based operating system, not unlike Windows being a GUI running on top of DOS.

Yes, but there is no comparison between the Unix kernel underlying OS X and the MS-DOS kernel underlying Windows. MS-DOS wasn't even original, it was a rip-off of the earlier CpM (Control Program Microprocessor).
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#21127 - 03/20/12 04:39 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: ryck]
roger Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Vermont
Originally Posted By: ryck
Originally Posted By: roger
not much, actually. new Macbook Air is $949, a new iMac is $1149. you can get a good, large monitor for $200.

But isn't that an apple and an orange? The basic MacBook Air and the basic iMac are quite different in terms of memory, storage, processor, et cetera. What's the cost of the equivalent MacBook Air?


I think you mean MacBook Pro, but I get your point. The basic MacBook Pro and the basic iMac cost the same, so yes, there would be an added cost for a large monitor. however, it's not that much, and the point of the article is that mobile, portable machines with a common OS seem to be the coming thing. there will likely always be a market for those that want (dare I call it) a brick-and-mortar desktop, but having the flexibility to grab your computer and take it with you, and just hook up to a big screen when you need it seems to make sense to me. I don't think it will be long before tablets and phones compete with laptops and desktops on a processor/memory level. I'm sure that bluetooth (or similar technology) monitors exist, and just by placing your tablet or phone in proximity to them they become the main monitor.
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#21128 - 03/20/12 04:53 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: roger]
artie505 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
> I don't think it will be long before tablets and phones compete with laptops and desktops on a processor/memory level.

As for memory, I wouldn't be surprised if at least part of the ultimate purpose of "The Cloud" is to eliminate the need for all but minimal memory, electronic, and, therefore, physical, in devices.


Edited by artie505 (03/20/12 05:08 AM)
Edit Reason: Clarification
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#21129 - 03/20/12 06:51 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: artie505]
alternaut Offline

Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Combining that with the implantable Mac you alluded to above, it looks that 'all' you're really waiting for is the brain interface-cloud link to become a puppet beyond a string. A deuced Mac(hina) indeed... shocked smirk
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#21130 - 03/20/12 06:57 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: artie505]
roger Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Vermont
Originally Posted By: artie505
> I don't think it will be long before tablets and phones compete with laptops and desktops on a processor/memory level.

As for memory, I wouldn't be surprised if at least part of the ultimate purpose of "The Cloud" is to eliminate the need for all but minimal memory, electronic, and, therefore, physical, in devices.


good point, though the infrastructure of the net will need to improve before that can happen, though I don't doubt that's where we're headed.
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#21131 - 03/20/12 07:26 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: alternaut]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: alternaut
Combining that with the implantable Mac you alluded to above, it looks that 'all' you're really waiting for is the brain interface-cloud link to become a puppet beyond a string. A deuced Mac(hina) indeed... shocked smirk

Man, does that conjure up a hideous ~ Kafkaesque situation should that brain develop schizophrenia or Alzheimer's or .... tongue

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#21132 - 03/20/12 08:45 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: roger]
Virtual1 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Iowa
Originally Posted By: roger
Originally Posted By: ryck
Originally Posted By: roger
but at a savings of many dollars.

I suppose....if you're going to own both a laptop and a desktop. And, if you only need the desktop, I'm sure it would be cheaper than a laptop and a screen.


not much, actually. new Macbook Air is $949, a new iMac is $1149. you can get a good, large monitor for $200.


Remember that supersmall also costs extra. It's not just $200 vs a display. There's also an SSD in there. I think a batter comparison would be SSD+supersmall+$200 = big display. Solving that with numbers pulled completely out of thin air, I could translate that to $150+$150+$200 = $500.
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#21133 - 03/20/12 11:14 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: alternaut]
artie505 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: alternaut
Combining that with the implantable Mac you alluded to above, it looks that 'all' you're really waiting for is the brain interface-cloud link to become a puppet beyond a string. A deuced Mac(hina) indeed... shocked smirk

Don't be so quick to smirk , don't be surprised by the length of the line at the Apple Store on day one of "OS X Adam," and don't expect to find me on it!

Steve is on record as having said that the next ten years of Apple are rooted in "The Cloud," and I don't doubt that research into at least some aspects of your "brain interface-cloud link" has been underway for some time, somewhere on Infinite Loop.


Edited by artie505 (03/20/12 11:28 AM)
Edit Reason: Expand/Clarify
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#21134 - 03/20/12 11:16 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: Virtual1]
roger Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Vermont
I'm a little confused by what you're saying, but here's what I see: in the not-too-distant future, we will carry around our "phone" which will actually be the "head" of our computing system. it will have plenty of local storage which we won't necessarily need as most things will be cloud-connected (I think I just read that some chip manufacturer had just achieved a terabyte on a square inch), and the processor will be ample enough for nearly any computing job that most people and businesses will need. at home, I walk to my desk where there is a large monitor and wireless keyboard/pad and I don't even need to take the phone out of my pocket. the same is true for work, or Starbucks... big screens on the wall, keyboards, all connect wirelessly to my phone. add in a headset, SIRI, etc., and sure, the "phone" could be implanted in my arm.

there will always be a need for larger, "main-frame" type computers, but a separate desktop won't be necessary.

it will be sooner than you think. and I should add, I certainly don't think any of this is my original idea, I'm no seer. laugh


Edited by roger (03/20/12 11:17 AM)
Edit Reason: clarification?
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#21135 - 03/20/12 01:12 PM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: roger]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
The App Store really bugs me. mad Just launch and take a gander... what am I? 12 years old?

It's a freakin' toy store... and they still don't even have a single chess program worth beans.

R.I.P “Σ” (sigma) Chess. frown

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#21136 - 03/20/12 02:43 PM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: Hal Itosis]
artie505 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
> [...] they still don't even have a single chess program worth beans.

It's in the works, along with the iTunes plugin that accommodates classical music listeners. frown

Edit: It surprises me that "Chess" is still a bundled app...or is it? (It's been four years since I bought a new deuced Mac(hina).)


Edited by artie505 (03/20/12 03:04 PM)
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#21143 - 03/21/12 02:29 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
In Lion Chess.app came bundled.
Version 2.4.5, 8.3MB; created in June 2011, modified in Feb 2012.

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#21149 - 03/21/12 10:00 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: grelber]
Hal Itosis Offline


Registered: 09/03/09
Loc: 10.6.8 (build 10K549)
Originally Posted By: grelber
In Lion Chess.app came bundled.
Version 2.4.5, 8.3MB; created in June 2011, modified in Feb 2012.

If it's anything like Snow Leopard, that's not gonna cut it.

The 2-D view is useless... we have to play 3-D. No list of moves, no opening book, no collections (or a library of past tournaments), can't step back-AND-forth through a saved game, can't take back ONE move when playing against computer (must undo both moves). It's just a toy. Follow the link for Sigma Chess to see where a program should start feature-wise.

There are actually a few halfway decent games on iOS. What's needed is a package that covers both MacOS and iOS that has those useful features (and more) which also shares a common database of saved games.

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#21151 - 03/21/12 10:05 AM Re: Another doomsday prediction [Re: Hal Itosis]
artie505 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
My point in asking was only to find out if Chess is still bundled with OS X, as opposed to the assorted computer games that no longer are (on low end deuced Mac(hina)s, anyhow).
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