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#17909 - 10/05/11 02:29 AM Questions about Magic Mouse
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Addendum:

As much as I like the Magic Mouse, in a few short days it's wreaked havoc on my lateral carpus (pisiform bone, which juts out slightly). So I'm back to using a wrist cushion. Any other suggestions?

And I switched the scroll feature to not "natural" (which is natural for me – not the switching, but the scrolling).


Edited by cyn (10/26/11 02:55 PM)
Edit Reason: Changed thread subject from "iMac desktops"

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#17910 - 10/05/11 04:41 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
joemikeb Online
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Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: grelber
As much as I like the Magic Mouse, in a few short days it's wreaked havoc on my lateral carpus (pisiform bone, which juts out slightly). So I'm back to using a wrist cushion. Any other suggestions?

It took me a while to learn all the "gestures" but I find the Magic Trackpad absolutely invaluable for Lion. You do not move either your arm or your wrist. All the movement is in the fingertips.
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#18044 - 10/07/11 11:20 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: joemikeb]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
You do not move either your arm or your wrist. All the movement is in the fingertips.

I am not Lion so the Magic Trackpad is not for me. However, use a Kensington trackball, which is essentially the same thing (just fingers), and have to agree with the reduced strain. I started with trackballs when Kensington made the first one around 1985 (with a ball about the size of a billiard ball) and have not used a mouse since.

ryck
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#18585 - 10/19/11 02:41 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: ryck]
sapien Offline
Banned

Registered: 10/17/11
I tried a Trackpad, it works and is great, but it's very hard on my wrist after just a few minutes. I can't rest my fingers on the trackpad either cause the pointer'll scroll around... How are you overcoming these problems?

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#18588 - 10/19/11 05:44 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: sapien]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
I use the iPad cover folded to become an elevated rest and rest my wrists on the table or desktop the iPad is sitting on. It takes a bit of practice to learn to hold you're fingers off of the screen, but III can do it almost any should've able to do it.

Sent from my iPad at Disney's Old Key West resort at Walt DisneyWorld
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#18590 - 10/19/11 06:57 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: sapien]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: sapien
I tried a Trackpad, it works and is great, but it's very hard on my wrist after just a few minutes. I can't rest my fingers on the trackpad either cause the pointer'll scroll around... How are you overcoming these problems?

I think we're talking about different products. I use a trackball which is essentially a mouse turned upside down. i.e. instead of moving a mouse to get a ball rolling, you roll the ball with the ends of your fingers.

I think that accidental cursor movement is not an issue because it's a mechanical device rather than an electronic device like a trackpad. That is, because the ball needs to roll more to have the cursor travel far on screen, any accidental movement is minor.

As well, all the Mouse Preferences for things like tracking and scrolling speed are applicable to the trackball.


Edited by ryck (10/19/11 07:00 AM)
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#18594 - 10/19/11 12:20 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: ryck]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Speaking of Magic Mouse ...

The batteries in that little sucker sure don't last long!
Despite their being Energizer Advanced AA (with a shelf life to March 2018), after less than 20 days' use, they're down to 25% capacity (= battery level, according to the meter in System Preferences under Mouse). And I turn the MM off overnight and on other occasions when I won't be using the computer for 6 hours or more.
I don't know when that means they'll crap out completely. But let's say they last a month, that's 24 AAs per year — a tidy sum to add to the cost of use.
I probably should have opted for the corded version (as I did with the keyboard), but I liked some of the features of the MM.
(I know, bitch, bitch, bitch ... but I would not have expected such a rapid drain, even though I was warned that third-party wireless mice were notorious for eating up batteries.)

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#18595 - 10/19/11 01:02 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
artie505 Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Originally Posted By: grelber
Speaking of Magic Mouse ...

The batteries in that little sucker sure don't last long!
Despite their being Energizer Advanced AA (with a shelf life to March 2018), after less than 20 days' use, they're down to 25% capacity (= battery level, according to the meter in System Preferences under Mouse). And I turn the MM off overnight and on other occasions when I won't be using the computer for 6 hours or more.
I don't know when that means they'll crap out completely. But let's say they last a month, that's 24 AAs per year — a tidy sum to add to the cost of use.
I probably should have opted for the corded version (as I did with the keyboard), but I liked some of the features of the MM.
(I know, bitch, bitch, bitch ... but I would not have expected such a rapid drain, even though I was warned that third-party wireless mice were notorious for eating up batteries.)

I can't link to any of them, but I recall reading several posts in which people have mentioned that rechargeable batteries are the way to go.
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#18596 - 10/19/11 01:25 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: artie505]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: artie505
I can't link to any of them, but I recall reading several posts in which people have mentioned that rechargeable batteries are the way to go.

If they were reliable, it'd be the way to go.

But my experience over the past couple decades has been that they aren't. In particular, I've found that they don't hold a charge for very long and that they leak. The latter issue might be a tad expensive if not caught in time (ie, necessitate the purchase of a new mouse).

Tack on to that the initial outlay for the charger and NiCads and AAs on sale come out the "winner" over at least the medium term.

I could always switch back to my corded optical mouse, but it doesn't have features that I like in the MM (and that I've gotten so used to that when I use a standard PC mouse I get irked when it won't scroll with my finger tip).

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#18603 - 10/19/11 02:56 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
dkmarsh Offline
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Registered: 08/04/09
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#18604 - 10/19/11 04:06 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: grelber
In particular, I've found that they don't hold a charge for very long and that they leak.

Tack on to that the initial outlay for the charger and NiCads and AAs on sale come out the "winner" over at least the medium term.
Your problems may be due to the fact that you're using NiCads. If NiCads are not fully drained before recharging, the amount of time they hold their charge time gets continuously less.

NiMH (Nickel-metal Hydride) are the way to go. They don't care when they're recharged and you can recharge them many more times (I've heard that some are up to 1,000 times).

You'll note that the Apple charger/batteries that dkmarsh has suggested are NiMH.


Edited by ryck (10/19/11 04:14 PM)
Edit Reason: spelling
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#18606 - 10/19/11 04:15 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
tacit Offline


Registered: 08/03/09
Loc: Portland, Oregon, USA
Originally Posted By: grelber
But my experience over the past couple decades has been that they aren't. In particular, I've found that they don't hold a charge for very long and that they leak. The latter issue might be a tad expensive if not caught in time (ie, necessitate the purchase of a new mouse).


Yep, rechargeable battery technology has advanced quite a lot in the last decade or so.

NiCd batteries--the old-fashioned rechargeable batteries--pretty much suck. They have limited capacity, they have limited power (1.2 volts rather than 1.5 volts), they leak, and they store very little charge.

Newer batteries, like NiMH and lithium ion, are a lot better. Lithium ion rechargeables are actually more powerful than disposable alkaline batteries; they last longer than alkalines and can be recharged. Of course, their failure modes tend to be pretty unpleasant, but in applications like rechargeable mice they're unlikely to fail catastrophically.
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#18614 - 10/20/11 12:59 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: tacit]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Merci, tacit et al.

I'll check it out. The Apple write-up is impressive.
$29 from the Apple Store — not too bad (but the shipping fee is).

So far locally I can find it only at Best Buy ($31), but I'll check other Apple outlets (eg, Staples, Walmart, Future Shop, London Drug).

EDIT: Well, it turns out that only Best Buy carries the battery charger (in stock*). But they matched the Apple Store's online price (less 10% of the difference ... Ooo, 20 cents).
(* The campus computer store can order it in at the Apple Store price.)
From the write-up chances are that the NiMH batteries will outlast the iMac/Magic Mouse.


Edited by grelber (10/20/11 09:03 AM)
Edit Reason: Purchased

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#18725 - 10/26/11 03:13 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
More on Magic Mouse:

Well, the original AA batteries (Energizer Advanced) crapped out at a battery level of 5%, tested voltage 1.0v. At 5% connection of mouse to computer became erratic. They lasted merely 25 days.

I'm trying the new NiMH rechargeables which came with the Apple Battery Charger. Fully charged they show a battery level of 88%. (I don't know what to make of that; I can't imagine that they're 'defective'.) Now we'll have to see how long they last.

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#18731 - 10/26/11 11:49 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Your energizers produce 5.5 volts while NiMH batteries supply a nominal 1.25 volts so your 88% is about right. I use a little app called Mighty Monitor which compensates for both the number and kind of batteries being used in the wireless keyboard, mouse, and trackpad so it is not confusing.
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#18732 - 10/26/11 12:17 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: joemikeb]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
I'm pretty sure you mean 1.5v (not 5.5v) for the Energizers.

EDIT: As it turns out (and which I forgot to mention) the NiMHs tested out at 1.5v just prior to being put into the mouse.
And a spare set charged and sitting in a drawer still test at 1.5v.

What's even more interesting ... When I put the NiMHs into the mouse straight from the charger, they registered 88% on the battery level meter. After several hours' use they now register 100%. Go figure.


Edited by grelber (10/27/11 06:50 AM)

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#18734 - 10/26/11 02:15 PM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
dianne Offline
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Thread temporarily closed for clean up.

Edit by moderator: this branch of posts has been detached from iMac desktops, moved to Peripherals, and renamed.


Edited by dianne (10/26/11 02:27 PM)
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#19157 - 11/14/11 02:37 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Update on MM's batteries:
As noted earlier, the alkaline Energizers which came with the mouse lasted a mere 26 days [correction from previous note].
I switched to rechargeables (which came with the Apple Battery Charger), and the first set lasted 18 days before having to be switched out.

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#19162 - 11/14/11 06:55 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: grelber
As noted earlier, the alkaline Energizers which came with the mouse lasted a mere 26 days [correction from previous note].
I switched to rechargeables (which came with the Apple Battery Charger), and the first set lasted 18 days before having to be switched out.

That is pretty much in line with my Magic Mouse experience and, if anything, the Magic Trackpad, eats batteries even faster. On the other hand, while I have not rigorously done the math, I am convinced the Apple Ni-Mh rechargeables are cheaper in the long run as long as you do not mind having to switch them out more often.

Originally Posted By: grelber
As it turns out (and which I forgot to mention) the NiMHs tested out at 1.5v just prior to being put into the mouse.
And a spare set charged and sitting in a drawer still test at 1.5v.

Interesting, because if you read the very fine print on Apple's rechargeable batteries (I had to break out a magnifying glass to read it) it says…

Originally Posted By: Apple
Size AA Ni-Mh Min 1900 mAh 1.2V HR6

emphasis added

I suspect your VOM lacks the necessary sensitivity for accurate testing.
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#19167 - 11/14/11 08:12 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: joemikeb]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Originally Posted By: joemikeb
... I am convinced the Apple Ni-Mh rechargeables are cheaper in the long run ...

I agree entirely.

Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Originally Posted By: grelber
As it turns out (and which I forgot to mention) the NiMHs tested out at 1.5v just prior to being put into the mouse.
And a spare set charged and sitting in a drawer still test at 1.5v.

Interesting, because if you read the very fine print on Apple's rechargeable batteries (I had to break out a magnifying glass to read it) it says…
Originally Posted By: Apple
Size AA Ni-Mh Min 1900 mAh 1.2V HR6

I suspect your VOM lacks the necessary sensitivity for accurate testing.

You may be right. But I just rechecked zeroing on my voltmeter, as well as bunch of fully-charged batteries of varying voltages (from 1.5v to 9v nominal) and they all tested out according to spec. I then rechecked the pair of fully-recharged Apple batteries that I pulled out of the MM yesterday, and they tested (once again) at 1.5v on the button.

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#19247 - 11/18/11 02:15 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: grelber]
grelber Offline


Registered: 08/05/09
Loc: North of 49th ||
Well, Magic Mouse lives up to its name:
While I was away from the iMac, "Curious Cat" managed to launch Launchpad and move (swipe) between screens.
Perhaps the little video demos in Mouse Preferences should include paws as well as fingers.

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#19249 - 11/18/11 05:42 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: joemikeb]
MicroMatTech3 Offline


Registered: 08/04/09
A friend of mine who is a connoisseur of rechargeable batteries recommends this investment:

Maha Powerex Wizard One MH-C9000 Advanced Battery Charger and Analyzer
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#19250 - 11/18/11 06:03 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: MicroMatTech3]
jchuzi Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: New York State
For the same price, you can get the wired Apple Mouse and never have to deal with batteries again.
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#19252 - 11/18/11 06:24 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: jchuzi]
joemikeb Online
Moderator

Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Fort Worth, Texas
Originally Posted By: jchuzi
For the same price, you can get the wired Apple Mouse and never have to deal with batteries again.

However that leaves you dealing with those pesky cords running all over the desktop. tongue

Personally I find periodically replacing the batteries much less annoying than constantly dealing with the cords that are always in the way.
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#19256 - 11/18/11 07:11 AM Re: Questions about Magic Mouse [Re: MicroMatTech3]
ryck Online


Registered: 08/04/09
Loc: Okanagan Valley
Originally Posted By: MicroMatTech3
A friend of mine who is a connoisseur of rechargeable batteries recommends this investment:

Maha Powerex Wizard One MH-C9000 Advanced Battery Charger and Analyzer

I note that Amazon gets them from Thomas Distributing and I will vouch for their service. I've been dealing with Thomas for about 10 years and they are first rate. Also, the Powerex is a good battery. I use the 2500 mAh and have never been disappointed.


Edited by ryck (11/18/11 07:12 AM)
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