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Macbook will not TURN ON
#16751 07/30/11 06:51 AM
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Replaced RAM (maxed) and HD (WD Caviar Black 500) on 2006 Macbook. Starts up with question mark. Put in Leopard startup disk, boots, I went to Disk utility, HD doesn't show up. Went back to OWC video:

http://eshop.macsales.com/installvideos/macbook_13/

(hadn't looked at it since my friend bought the upgrade a while back, this is all for someone else. Be smart and quit doing favors. It gets expensive.) I'd put drive correctly in the bracket but put that assembly upside down into the computer (the drive slips into a lengthwise tunnel.) Somehow in went in far enough to close it up without a problem???
(You can't get any view of the connection because it's at the far end of the tunnel. I fixed it and now I press the startup button, ABSOLUTELY nothing happens. (The Leopard disk is inside.)

The battery is at 20% so I plugged it in, pulled the battery and plugged it in, zapped the pram, reseated the ram chips, zapped the pram again. pulled the battery and the power supply and held down the start button for about 10 secs. Nothing.

So I pulled the drive part way out and back, did all the above again, nothing.

So I pulled the drive completely. This time the rubber bumper strips glued to the inside sides came loose, one even fell off and I took them out along with all the bits of rubbery glue with long tweezers. None of the glue appeared to be at the end of the tunnel near the connectors. Should I wipe them with what, alcohol, just to make sure? could I jump the pin receptors and ruin the assembly? It's almost impossible to see.

Anyway, I screwed the bumper strips to the sides if the HD bracket. They were the length of the bracket. There were dents in them where the bracket screws were, but if you flipped them, there were holes that matched the screw locations, the screws were long enough, apparently this problem had happened during drive updates before. Carefully and slowly, Pushing the rubber along, I slid the drive back in and it went in further this time. Put it all back together. No startup. Nothing.

Did all of the above again. Person I was helping had to go, I didn't want to take it home and spend more time on it because my head was exploding, but did call OWC when I got home. I could't stand thinking I'd blown the logic board and at the very least would have to pay for the drive. RATS! They said the drive was dead and he would swap it out. He was so certain.

Is he right?





Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
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Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16752 07/30/11 06:59 AM
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> They said the drive was dead and he would swap it out. He was so certain.

Is he right?


I don't know, but I've got my fingers crossed for ya!


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
artie505 #16753 07/30/11 07:11 AM
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Thanks!


Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
2.4GHz, 750GB SATA HD, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.7.5
1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
Netgear WN2500RP Range Extender (Ira rocks!)
Linksys WRT1900AC Wireless Router
Brother MFC-9340CDW Color Laser
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Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16755 07/30/11 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Is he right?

There is no way to tell for sure other than mounting the drive in another enclosure to see if it works. You could check the connections in the MacBook by re-installing the original drive (assuming it was working). However if OWC is telling you the drive is dead, and offering to send you a replacement, I would most definitely take them up on it.

Normally when I order an upgrade drive from OWC I get the kit that includes an external enclosure with the intention of putting the old drive in that. I can also use the external enclosure to test the new drive if there are problems.


If we knew what it was we were doing, it wouldn't be called research, would it?

— Albert Einstein
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16773 08/01/11 03:14 PM
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yep those rubber tracks inside the macbooks will come unglued if you get rough with them

the #1 cause of problems with them is incorrect placement of the screws when replacing the hard drive. if you look closely you'll see theres a small shoulder on two of the four screws. those screws go on the pull-tab end of the drive. if you put them on the other end, they put a lot of drag on the tracks and can pull them loose when removing, or push them in and wad them up inside the bay when installing. They're very tricky to get back into place without taking off the top case.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
Virtual1 #16781 08/01/11 06:53 PM
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How easy is it to take off the top case? The bottom looked like a no-no. At least then I could see the connection because where the pins are on the new HD have a housing around them the old one doesn't and I would like to see the HD actually seated.


Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
2.4GHz, 750GB SATA HD, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.7.5
1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
Netgear WN2500RP Range Extender (Ira rocks!)
Linksys WRT1900AC Wireless Router
Brother MFC-9340CDW Color Laser
iPad Air
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16782 08/01/11 07:26 PM
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Virtual,

Have you ever heard of a computer being completely dead because it has a bad HD in it?

Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16791 08/02/11 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted By: slolerner
How easy is it to take off the top case?


The number "23" sounds familiar here.

loosen 3 on ramdoor cover
remove 3 under ramdoor cover
remove 2 inside right battery bay
remove 4 of 9 on near side (2,4,7,9)
remove 2 outside LEFT (not opposte the other 2 inside bay)
remove 3 bottom
remove 4 rear

hmmm only 21 I guess, all philips PH0. better use a good small tool too.

Near left corner likes to snag. Clips on near right and also on far right (the clips may not be captive, watch for them to try to escape) CAREFULLY unplug top case connector before lifting off. Danger Will Robinson, easy to damage that connector.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
Virtual1 #16803 08/03/11 01:45 AM
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I put back the old HD and RAM that it used to start on. Nothing. I'm so upset. How can this happen?


Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
2.4GHz, 750GB SATA HD, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.7.5
1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
Netgear WN2500RP Range Extender (Ira rocks!)
Linksys WRT1900AC Wireless Router
Brother MFC-9340CDW Color Laser
iPad Air
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16823 08/04/11 06:40 PM
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Maybe it's broke? "but it can't be broke! it was working fine the other day!" oh, yes it can. When something is broke, and it wasn't broke before, there's a finite point in time where it made the transition. And that point can be last week, yesterday, this morning, or four minutes ago.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16827 08/04/11 07:47 PM
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> I'd put drive correctly in the bracket but put that assembly upside down into the computer (the drive slips into a lengthwise tunnel.) Somehow in went in far enough to close it up without a problem???

That may be it. frown

I recently swapped HDs in my Early 2009 MacBook, and I, too, put the new one in upside down, but I was unable to get it all the way into its bay...didn't even try after it resisted.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
artie505 #16836 08/05/11 02:33 AM
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I guess I broke it. There are so many diagrams in the battery case about everything, and not one word that the drive goes in upside down. Going to the shop tomorrow.


Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
2.4GHz, 750GB SATA HD, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.7.5
1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
Netgear WN2500RP Range Extender (Ira rocks!)
Linksys WRT1900AC Wireless Router
Brother MFC-9340CDW Color Laser
iPad Air
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16837 08/05/11 04:29 AM
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Originally Posted By: slolerner
I guess I broke it. There are so many diagrams in the battery case about everything, and not one word that the drive goes in upside down. Going to the shop tomorrow.

In my experience, Apple is not terribly forthcoming with details about either the tools or procedures necessary for users to service "user serviceable" components...a deterrent, I guess, although I won't speculate about what, precisely, Apple is deterring.

Your possible present predicament, the "shouldered screws" mentioned earlier by V1, and, as I posted a while back, the lack of details about which Torx wrench is required to remove the HD backing to which the pull-tab is attached are all excellent examples. frown

But perhaps there's still hope, so keep your fingers crossed. (I haven't uncrossed mine yet. smile )


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
artie505 #16840 08/05/11 07:38 AM
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I looked around the web. This has happened to many people. Makes me feel a little better, but it may be a $200 fix. Rats.

You're right about the wrenches. The L-bracket to get to the drive bay is a phillips head, the drive sled screws obviously are torx. What really grinds me is every now and then I run into the torx they don't want the user to remove and I need to pull out my 'black market' torx with the little hole in the middle.

I really appreciate your crossed fingers. They must hurt by now!


Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
2.4GHz, 750GB SATA HD, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.7.5
1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
Netgear WN2500RP Range Extender (Ira rocks!)
Linksys WRT1900AC Wireless Router
Brother MFC-9340CDW Color Laser
iPad Air
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16849 08/05/11 03:27 PM
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apple has never used security torx. they do use triwing and pentalobes though for internal batteries however.

the torx you need is either a T6 or T8 standard. you should have those in your kit, or you need a new kit.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
Virtual1 #16957 08/11/11 10:57 PM
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Well, I tore the plastic tab on the drive sled while pulling out the old drive and bought a new one from these guys and sent them my tale of woe. This was their reply:

Quote:
I'm sorry to hear that you've had such trouble. The repair techs feel very confident that you have not blown up your friends logic board, but perhaps just damaged where the connectors on the hard drive itself or on the cable that connects the hard drive to the logic board. I would recommend taking the top case off and making sure that the drive fits securely and that no debris is in the connector, and also check to make sure that the pins were not bent. You may need a new one:

http://www.powerbookmedic.com/13-MacBook-Hard-Drive-Cable-p-17232.html

used, they are $2.95

Here's a repair guide to the computer as well:

http://www.powerbookmedic.com/manual.php?id=1


One of the videos shows how to lift the topcase. Thoughts? Is it the drive cable? or am I making things worse? I found this:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=464042

At the bottom of page:

Quote:
I took it in to the Apple store, and they were nice enough to take it to the lab to check if it was a faulty top case. It was, as their tests showed, but I thought I could get a better deal elsewhere (they wanted ~$200 for parts/labor) so I looked, but didn't get a better deal. Turns out on the original Macbook Apple didn't fully cover up all the important exposed components in the battery bay, so a tiny piece of shiny metal (technical terms I know) above the trackpad was exposed. We bent this while pulling the hard drive out, and either that or ESD ruined it. On my new top case this part is covered with a plasticy material... I wonder why... wish I could get some money out of Apple for this for a manufacturing defect. None of you know a way to do that do you?

Well now my computer is up and running again. Thank you all for your thoughtful help. Now to backup my data and get that bigger drive working!


I don't quite understand this. Can anyone explain and can I fix this?


Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
2.4GHz, 750GB SATA HD, 8 GB RAM, OS 10.7.5
1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
Netgear WN2500RP Range Extender (Ira rocks!)
Linksys WRT1900AC Wireless Router
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Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16982 08/12/11 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted By: slolerner
Have you ever heard of a computer being completely dead because it has a bad HD in it?


Only once. It had a shorted +5 on the controller card and it was safetying the power supply and preventing the computer from turning on. It's very rare, but it can happen.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16983 08/12/11 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted By: slolerner
I guess I broke it. There are so many diagrams in the battery case about everything, and not one word that the drive goes in upside down. Going to the shop tomorrow.


It would be very challenging to force a 2.5 sata into the bay upside-down. It'd have to do a lot of mechanical damage. It should have stopped cold about 1/4" from being where it belonged, and been quite obvious to have hit a full-stop.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16984 08/12/11 09:06 PM
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The plastic tab is just a pull tab, you can replace it with a bit of folded over packing tape. It's not necessary to replace it with a new one.

Being frank, if you're damaging hard drives while trying to replace them from a drive bay, I don't know if you want to attempt a top case removal.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
Virtual1 #16987 08/13/11 01:08 AM
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Defensively here, I did find other stories on the net of others who also put them in upside down, closed them, and they wouldn't start up even after being flipped but there were no replies to those posts. I'm not the only one who did it, it may have been firm to get it in there but I thought that was the rubber rails resisting, but seating the RAM in that model was firm, also. I appreciate the warning.

I feel completely confident taking off the topcase. I just don't know if it's worth it. If I KNOW it's the HD cable or there's a good chance, yes. If, like the other guy I quoted, damage to the bottom of the trackpad will be visible, yes, I'll know I need a new topcase. (It also seems like with the mess with the bumper rails, it would be easier to put the drive in being able to access everything.)

Where is the controller card on a notebook, duh(?) Would the problem correct itself when an ok drive went in?

Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #16996 08/13/11 06:59 PM
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you can get cheap macbook top cases from macsales.com, they sell the ones that get replaced for "cracking under the lid rests", you can get them cheap if you need one.

the controller is on the logic board, most laptops have most of the parts on the board. the wireless is a universal exception but that's the only thing to expect.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
Virtual1 #16998 08/13/11 09:26 PM
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Well, after your vote of confidence the other day about my lifting the lid wink I decided to hit the streets with this computer. I always make my maps and use sticky tape when I take out screws, but this computer put the whammy on me so nothing will go right.

The place I usually go offered to lift the topcase for $150 and said it would probably have to go to Apple for a $250 repair. So, I left "Mr. Green" and went a few blocks away to a place I wanted to try anyway. "Nice Guy Eddie" told me he would lift the topcase for $75 and the part was actually an Apple recall because of the problem you mention and would get me a good deal on the replacement.

I figured out that the controller was on the logic board when I couldn't find it sold as a part. I had to take my anti-nausea medicine.

I actually did see "Mr. Brown" for those of you who know what I'm talking about. Apparently he's doing a project in New York because one of my friends saw him, too.

Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
slolerner #17014 08/14/11 03:28 PM
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The free replacement ("Quality Program" coverage) includes parts and labor, if you are paying for the replacement of the top case, you are being cheated. Threaten to report them to Apple for insurance fraud, they will change their tun quick.

They would be expected to charge you something minor to replace the sata cable and reseat the guides though, but $75 is excessive. Here we'd fix the guides for free but replacing the cable probably 1/2 hr labor, $45, plus parts I suppose, another $15-25. I suppose $75 may be on the high end of reasonable.


I work for the Department of Redundancy Department
Re: Macbook will not TURN ON
Virtual1 #17021 08/14/11 10:08 PM
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I think if I can get out of this for around $75, it's the low end of reasonable by New York prices. The top case didn't break because of the palm rests, it seems I broke it by shoving a drive in upside down. I'm not sure where I stand.

I don't want to have to replace this clustermess with another computer and I won't have this one thumbing it's nose at me anymore.

Why can't every computer love me like my Titanium? Replaced 2 Hard drives, had 3 DVD drives (2nd was an upgrade, 3rd one was a piece of dirt inside that scratched every DVD), and a RAM upgrade. Sniff. Someone get me a tissue.

Last edited by slolerner; 08/14/11 10:12 PM. Reason: signature added

Mid 2010 MacBook Pro 13"
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1 HDX1500 2TB Ext.HD, 2 HDX1500 1TB Ext.HD
HP Laserjet 6MP printing postscript via 10/100 Intel print server
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Macbook will not TURN ON
#17054 08/17/11 02:31 AM
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Well Artie, you can uncross your fingers now, and V1, they gave me the top case for free, even put in the new drive and sled for free after they got it working with the old drive first. (Was afraid to give them the new drive until they got it running off the original drive.)

All they could tell me is as soon as they put the new top on, the computer started right up.

AND, the computer owner I was doing the favor for paid the $75 charge to lift the top case. (I just started grumbling about this being the last computer favor I'm getting involved in.)

Thanks to all the patience of my FTM friends!

--Slo

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