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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
Hal Itosis #20709 02/18/12 08:25 PM
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jchuzi Offline OP
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Jon

macOS 11.1, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
Hal Itosis #20712 02/19/12 02:08 AM
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> I'm starting to see Apple software lose features and/or accumulate bugs... all because the focus seems to be on enhancing and integrating "The App Store" into everything.

Apple's grab for complete control over all content on our Macs, part of the problem, is exacerbated by sandboxing.

In addition to its resulting in functionality loss (as you suggested), I'm seeing app development slowed down because developers aren't certain of how the sandboxing issue will resolve.

How important is sandboxing?

Is it necessary in todays environment? Is it no more than an overreaction to some imaginary threat? Or is Apple being realistically visionary and conducting a pre-emptive strike against an amorphous, but nonetheless real, future threat? (Edit: Is this post the subject of a new thread...Mods?)

Edit 2: How important is sandboxing?

Last edited by artie505; 02/19/12 08:09 AM.

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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
artie505 #20716 02/19/12 03:05 AM
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Quote:
Apple's grab for complete control over all content on our Macs...

That's a tad hyperbolic even for you. laugh



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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
dkmarsh #20723 02/19/12 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted By: dkmarsh
Quote:
Apple's grab for complete control over all content on our Macs...

That's a tad hyperbolic even for you. laugh

Is it really?

Extending "control" to include Apple's being the source of supply rather than limiting it to control over content, etc. (which I assumed was implicit in my post) places them well along the way, and history suggests that they'll go for control over content, etc. as they strengthen their position as supplier.

I think it's visionary rather than hyperbolic. frown


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
artie505 #20728 02/19/12 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Extending "control" to include Apple's being the source of supply rather than limiting it to control over content, etc...

Not really sure what you mean here. Are you seriously "envisioning" a Mac App Store in which only software written by Apple is available? Why on earth would they want to do that? As it stands now, thousands of developers create an astounding variety of Mac software, and Apple's only cost for this cornucopia is maintaining the infrastructure by which it's made available—which cost is defrayed by 30% of the take. I doubt you'll see them pick up a much higher tab for the vast reduction in choice that banishing third-party apps would accomplish.

You must mean something else by complete control over all content, but I can't figure out what.



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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
dkmarsh #20733 02/19/12 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted By: dkmarsh
Not really sure what you mean here. Are you seriously "envisioning" a Mac App Store in which only software written by Apple is available? Why on earth would they want to do that? As it stands now, thousands of developers create an astounding variety of Mac software, and Apple's only cost for this cornucopia is maintaining the infrastructure by which it's made available—which cost is defrayed by 30% of the take. I doubt you'll see them pick up a much higher tab for the vast reduction in choice that banishing third-party apps would accomplish.

You must mean something else by complete control over all content, but I can't figure out what.

Perhaps he means that we are headed toward the day when only apps purchased from the MAS will function on OSX. All others will be Kept outside of the Gate. [that day already exists on iOS, unless jailbroken.]

Last edited by Hal Itosis; 02/19/12 04:59 PM.
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
Hal Itosis #20760 02/21/12 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted By: Hal Itosis
Originally Posted By: dkmarsh
Not really sure what you mean here. Are you seriously "envisioning" a Mac App Store in which only software written by Apple is available? Why on earth would they want to do that? As it stands now, thousands of developers create an astounding variety of Mac software, and Apple's only cost for this cornucopia is maintaining the infrastructure by which it's made available—which cost is defrayed by 30% of the take. I doubt you'll see them pick up a much higher tab for the vast reduction in choice that banishing third-party apps would accomplish.

You must mean something else by complete control over all content, but I can't figure out what.

Perhaps he means that we are headed toward the day when only apps purchased from the MAS will function on OSX. All others will be Kept outside of the Gate. [that day already exists on iOS, unless jailbroken.]

Brass ring to Hal...That's precisely what I meant, and my guess is that Apple's having cut middle-men out of the OS X distribution chain (which I predicted the day I heard that Lion was going to be a Mac App Store d/l) portends precisely that.

I'll offer the iTunes Store as an analogy: In 2003, Apple offered us the option to d/l our music, and now they've deprecated optical drives...no doubt because the iTunes Store has become the world's exclusive source for music. tongue

I can't argue against removable media's being a dying breed, but I think it's still a long way from dead...that Apple's position is, at today's date, more motivated by pushing recalcitrants to the iTunes Store and arbitrarily maximizing its profits than by a realistic vision of the immediate future of the optical drive CDs. (Further, but of absolutely no consequence to Apple is the fact that much, if not most, classical music [including operas] is unavailable as any sort of d/l, let alone high-quality. Oh... I forgot that we who favor that kind of music can buy ourselves USB...no, make that Thunderbolt optical drives.)

> All others will be Kept outside of the Gate. [that day already exists on iOS, unless jailbroken.]

I wonder whether anybody's considered making that a 1st Amendment issue, because, after all, Apple does include censorship in its review process?

Edit: Related posts

Last edited by artie505; 02/21/12 12:02 PM.

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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
artie505 #20765 02/21/12 12:07 PM
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It's not going to become a First Amendment issue; that could only happen if someone were preventing a person from speaking freely, say, online at all, not just in Apple's stores.

Video game consoles have already been challenged on that issue, since the console makers keep incredibly strict control over what is allowed to be released for a console, and it's never succeeded. Every game console maker--Sony, Nintendo, Microsoft, you name it--has tight limitations and exclusions about what is and is not allowed to be sold for their game consoles, and have the right to refuse to permit a developer to sell a game for any reason (or no reason at all), and those challenges have never been successful.


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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
tacit #20796 02/22/12 09:13 PM
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Not a game issue or a security issue, but still relevant to Mountain Lion:

What's keeping Mountain Lion off of some 64-bit Macs? Ars investigates


Jon

macOS 11.1, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
tacit #20799 02/22/12 10:24 PM
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> It's not going to become a First Amendment issue; that could only happen if someone were preventing a person from speaking freely, say, online at all, not just in Apple's stores.

At today's date, of course, but the Internet has changed things, and I suspect that we'll see some pretty interesting, not to mention very creative, cases making it to the Supreme Court in the future.

I don't envy the Justices who'll have to deal with them; they'll be breaking ground in areas that the Founding Fathers couldn't have begun to guess would ever exist.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
artie505 #20800 02/23/12 12:01 AM
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It's still not a First Amendment issue, because government isn't keeping anyone "outside the gate" of the Mac App Store.

Originally Posted By: 1st United States Congress
AMENDMENT I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Apple's behavior might be in violation of antitrust laws, but it's not unconstitutional.



dkmarsh • member, FineTunedMac Co-op Board of Directors
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
dkmarsh #20817 02/24/12 01:23 AM
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You're the history major... Good point!


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
jchuzi #20916 02/28/12 10:44 PM
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While we're linking to AppleInsider stories, here's one Mountain Lion feature that seems long overdue: a Preview of how Apple is improving file renaming.



dkmarsh • member, FineTunedMac Co-op Board of Directors
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
dkmarsh #20933 03/01/12 09:53 AM
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Everybody's climbing on board ... or: Why I might be going back to the library and also digging out my IBM Selectric II.

Smartphones Have Led, and Desktops Will Follow

Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
Hal Itosis #20996 03/07/12 01:53 PM
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Some pundits are already predicting the end of the laptop by 2017, while others are saying it will happen before, even well before then. Fewer and fewer people can justify carrying a laptop around when their iPad or even iPhone can do anything they need to do and without the bulk of the laptop. Since laptops were well on the way to supplanting desktop computers, I suppose that means our desktop computers will eventually be relegated to the same niche currently occupied by today's big tower machines like the Power Mac.

For those who don't like the new integrated computing paradigm I suppose Linux will still be available as an OS alternative.


joemikeb • moderator
Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
joemikeb #20997 03/07/12 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted By: joemikeb
Some pundits are already predicting the end of the laptop by 2017

I'm not sure either laptops or desktops will disappear anytime soon, but their market share is predicted to dip below that of tablets as early as 2013 (see When will tablets outsell traditional PCs?). Other pundits put that date back as far as 2017, but the trend seems clear.


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Re: Mountain Lion, the next cat
alternaut #20998 03/07/12 05:23 PM
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i don't mind the tablet form factor (e.g., the iPad). What i —and power-users in general —simply cannot abide is how helpless the user is rendered technologically, in terms of observing low level stuff (e.g., can't use a CLI terminal to study the entire filesystem, can't monitor processes or network connections, etc).

edit/ Apple's effort to 'stupefy' the user is perfectly illustrated by the lame network activity indicator in iOS: the spinning gear. Why not a red arrow (triangle) for send and a green arrow for receive? So simple, yet . . .

As such, tablets may be both fun and useful as secondary devices, but definitely won't ever serve the geek demographic as one's sole machine. Therefore i don't believe that "real" computers (e.g., the MacBook Air) will be disappearing anytime soon.

It might also be argued that serious content creation (graphic, video, whatever) and the touch-screen GUI aren't yet nearly a productive combination, as the more familiar (and malleable) mouse/trackpad + keyboard method. Even basic text input (such as composing this reply and maneuvering/scrolling around the edit box) is still somewhat "fiddly" on touch-screen... though (admittedly) partly due to how webpages are designed (layout, etc).

Last edited by Hal Itosis; 03/07/12 05:38 PM.
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