Looks good, if extensive. I don't want do to any long troubleshooting. I have two slipped discs in my lower back pressing into nerves, causing pain down my legs and into my feet. Chronic. Every second of every day. Sitting at the computer is one of more painful things I do, probably the most other than driving, which I also shouldn't do. I plan to spend very little time at the computer at least until I can make some progress. Standing briefly, not sitting. I have had this since last July and it seems I've tried everything to troubleshoot my back.




Edit: Originally a reply to slolerner in "10.6.3 to 10.6.8 font problem" [aka "fonts jagged when upgrading to 10.6.8"], this post and the follow-ups were detached and moved to the Lounge.

I'm not a doctor, but I play one on FTM. I have the same back problem and one of the discs ruptured and now I can't feel my foot because it is pressing on the S1 nerve, but you are in pain. First, see a VERY GOOD neurologist, dump the painkillers you may be taking, and get one of these belts for your back. Dr. has to prescribe it:

http://www.djoglobal.com/products/empi/empi-active

"Ah feel your pain."

I won't go into all the things I've tried, and this is a Mac forum, not a back forum. Nevertheless…

I'm supposed to get a steroid (prob. cortisone) shot soon. Hit or miss, from what I hear. Won't work, work for a day, a month, a few months, no one knows. Then you need another. Then they stop working. Will insurance pay? We'll see.

Oral steroid worked some, but you can only take it for 10 days, and it makes you somewhat hyper. Near the end, restlessness and trouble sleeping, but I did not become the Hulk.

Bought a $800 very firm Simmons mattress, the firmest in Mattress Firm, which probably makes a lot of difference, if only I could stop sleeping on my stomach, which is bad for everyone.

Bought a $600 Steelcase computer chair. Now sitting at the computer is the most painful thing I do, other than driving, even though both are adjustable. So much for the magic chair.

Bought a inversion table. This actually works. I recommend it to everyone, for stress, for back relief. Ten minutes, not bad. Not expensive. Relaxing. Lately however it seems to be pulling the muscles in my legs, so I've reduced it.

I never had good posture. Should've listened to Mom all those years ago. Slouching, crossing my legs, flipping one ankle onto my leg, sitting with my legs propped up, lying on the couch, sliding down. I was a dumb kid.

Fortunately I just discovered the miracle of the self-propelled lawn mower. Wow! What have I been doing to myself all these years?

Maybe one of the moderators can move this thread to the Lounge Forum. I would like to respond to deniro about the issues he is having with his back.

Thanks,
slo

Moving a troubleshooting thread to the Lounge isn't a good way to respond to a non-troubleshooting issue raised in that thread, but a new thread in the Lounge might be, if deniro chooses to respond there. Alternatively, since personal messages aren't active in FTMF, you could contact cyn with a request to contact deniro* with your contact and topic info, and leave it to him to respond to you.

*) It is FTM's policy not to publicize user email addresses, but to leave it to the users to make that decision themselves.

I've made a copy of my last post in this thread, so can you delete it and move the string of posts beginning with deniro's #30282 to the lounge?

Then I can repost my response to slolerner.

alternaut's right, moving the whole thread would not have been the way to go. As it turned out, though, I was able to detach the OT replies so could move them here to the Lounge and leave the font troubleshooting thread in place.

For the record, I'm not real keen on the email middleman role. I'd prefer those who are open to being contacted by other FTM members include an email address in their profile.

I'm going to take this opportunity to repeat a suggestion I made once before...

There are any number of instances in which we're asked or required to provide e-mail addresses to entities that neither need nor are entitled to them, and towards that end I maintain a "trash-mail" account, the address of which is given only to those particular entities, and which I can "trash" any time I feel like it; posting an address here would qualify as such an instance because of the possibility of its being harvested.

I do it under my ISP's mailbox quota, but I assume it can also be done via gmail.com.

If we both activate IM messages, would that be better?

I imagine that instant messaging would be better, because it would allow for more facile communication.

My suggestion is really directed at people who must post their e-mail addresses but are wary terrified, and rightfully so, of the possible repercussions.

I have my private messaging turned on, he has his disabled. This is getting like a soap opera.

Do you mean private messaging at FTM? If so, you only think so, because it's disabled...has been since day one.

Edit: You did the right thing starting this thread; ball's now in his court.

slolerner, why not respond to deniro about his back trouble here, in the thread created at your request for that purpose, instead of discussing other communication methods?

I wasn't sure if it was ok. I mean, it is a Mac Fixit site not a Back Fixit site.

Oops, a Fine Tuned Mac, not a Fine Tuned Back.

I just found this thread. If anyone wants to post about the subject, go ahead.

Deniro, hey. I had the moderator move our thread to here because it we got off subject. This threads for you!

I have had back problems for a very long time, am genetically predisposed to it.

I have had two types of injections: one is an epidural which is into spine and facet joint injections, into the spaces between specific bones:

http://www.spine-health.com/treatment/injections/cervical-thoracic-and-lumbar-facet-joint-injections

They both involve a steroid to shrink inflammation, inflammation is what actually causes pain, and an anesthetic to block the pain.

Although I have seen other patients get their epidural shot and walk out with a smile on their face, in my case that did not happen. I don't want to scare you, but unless you find a anesthesiologist that comes highly recommended, I wouldn't try it. I am certain my case was a rare exception but things went wrong. Epidurals are supposed to last about a year.

The facet joint injections, which have been very useful to me, are a bunch of very thin needles inserted exactly at the joints in your spine where the doctor, from the description of your symptoms, is thinking the pain originates. It is done when you are laying face down on a table and the doctor uses a CAT scan devise to see and guide the needles and make sure they are in exactly the right places and then the medicine is injected at each site at once. It takes less than an hour. If the pain persists in some places and not others, then he can go back and try a different spot later. It is very complex as far as where you feel the pain and where the inflammation that is causing it is.

I find these injections useful, they last I guess about six months, but they are very targeted so the amount of steroid is less. The point of doing all this stuff is not so you can sit in a chair again, it is so you can start doing more physical activity because you are not in as much pain and that physical therapy will help build up the core muscles and give your spine better support.

I use a chair with a perfectly flat and level seat, no arms, with about a half inch of foam padding covered in fabric. That's all. It glides easily on the floor, no casters. I found that being able to change position, wiggle, move my legs around really helps and it's never good for someone with a bad back to use their feet to push things around and most people use their feet and not their arms to move around in a chair on wheels.

Of all the chairs I sit in every day, my computer chair, the expensive "ergonomic" one is the most painful. I don't see why it's so expensive. It's plastic like any other chair, with a few more adjustments. No big deal.

Have you found a chair that gives you little or no pain? I can't sit in many, certainly not recliners or couches. Strait-backs actually seem more comfortable for me, for a while, whereas the computer chair hurts me after less than 10 minutes. My PT told me: Don't stay in one position for too long, whether sitting or standing. I'm a short guy, so I thought about finding a table low enough for me, as I usually have to lift up the chair and use a footstool. Sometimes I think the footstool makes it worse, compared to having my feet on the floor. Something about leg circulation, maybe. All the tables I've seen are the same height.

Everyone tells me don't get surgery because that always makes it worse. Unfortunately, a neurosurgeon said that I would definitely need surgery eventually, though maybe as far off as 10 years, provided the pain can be under control some. Degeneration of the discs. I certainly don't want to live life like this for 10 more years.

I got a cortisone shot a couple weeks ago. The neurosurgeon, a different one the first referred me to, told me that the pain would be worse before it got better. He was certainly right about the first part. Then after a week I did notice small improvement. I could drive again, not without pain, but at least I could do it.

At the same time, I started getting pain in my right leg. The injection was for the left (into the left lower back). Now I have sciatica in both legs. I should mention that I have two herniated discs. That's part of the problem when trying to treat the pain. Two sources of pain doing all kinds of weird things.

My sister, a physical therapist, also had back pain, and she suggested my family are genetically predisposed to back trouble, as you mentioned. Yet, of the seven of us, only she and I have had a problem. Both of us are overweight, I note, but not that much. If I could help that I would. The weight gain was caused years ago by medication given by an unscrupulous doctor. I'm not a couch potato. I can't even lay on the couch. I lay on the floor.

Oddly, the TENS unit sometimes cures the right leg pain altogether. Then I exacerbate it and it comes back. Doesn't do much for the left.

I've started using the inversion table again, and it helps on my left, but my right is always so painful that inversion almost makes it worse. If you use one, you shouldn't have pain getting on it, off, or in between. As in other aspects of life, if there's pain, stop doing it. Those who say no pain no gain are out of their minds. I wish I had ignored that stupid saying a long time ago.

I'm taking one or two Alleve/day (to reduce inflammation), gabapentin (Neurontin, for nerve pain), and Robaxin (a muscle relaxant).

I did try one of those large velcro belts that wraps around the midsection, but it made the pain worse.

The journey through the woods continues…

Hermann-Miller has two lines of ergonomic office chairs that have both worked very well for me for many years. Aeron chair ($1,100 to $1,500 depending on how it is configured) and the Mirra 2 for a couple of hundred less again depending on the specific configuration. Very expensive and IMHO worth very penny especially if you have back pain issues.


Try a Google search for "adjustable height computer table" and you will turn up any number of possibilities. I paid $900 or so for mine about 22 years ago. It is roughly kidney shaped and the keyboard portion and monitor portions are separately adjustable via hand cranks from sitting to standing height. The arc is such that everything is on an equidistant curve from the user and is made from â…ž inch 21 ply baltic birch plywood. This is very definitely a case of you get what you paid for.


My back pain was in the cervical region and over the years I have had three surgeries to fuse four of the cervical vertebrate, the last surgery to fuse the final two was earlier this year. My experience following all three surgeries has been awaking in the recovery room with the feeling something was wrong. The last time I knew immediately knew its the absence of pain after a year or more of constant pain. In my case all the surgeries were performed by neurosurgeons because the surfer was too close to the spinal chord for an orthopedic surgeon to attempt. The reason for the multiple surgeries is the cervical vertebrate continued to degenerate at other levels in the neck and each had to be repaired in its turn. At this point my neck is virtually solid but I have no pain and my neck is not too stiff. In the last two surgeries the doctors indicated the deterioration was far more advanced than indicated by CT scans and MRIs. My only regret was going so long between surgeries and suffering that much additional pain.


That was just about my experience. FWIW I have had no sciatica since the last surgery. Pulmonary embolisms yes, Sciatica no. The PEs were unrelated to the neck pain or the surgery.

I do know that lumbar surgery has the reputation of being a longer and more painful recovery If for no other reason than the mandatory back brace is bulkier and more uncomfortable than the neck brace. I also know that the protocols have improved dramatically in the last 5 years much less the last 20 years when my son had his lumbar fusion. I haven't heard any horror stories in a good while and with my radiologist son and hospital chaplain wife I used to hear a LOT of those. I would never encourage anyone to rush TO surgery but on the other hand neither would I encourage anyone to rush AWAY from surgery if it is really needed.

Hopefully you can get pain free and soon. Life is to short to live any of it in misery.

A very aged friend of the family discovered that the only relief he ever got from his excruciating back pain was during the drive from Florida to New York in his 1990-something Ford Taurus. He was so enthralled by the electrically adjustable driver's seat that he obtained one from a wrecker and had a buddy construct a proper base for it and put it in his living room. It did the job.

Another instance where it pays to think outside the box.

As I said, I have found sitting slightly forward in my flat, slightly padded chair has been the best. It allows me to move my legs around and stretch my back as well as have my feet flat on the floor (the chair is low, 17" from the floor and I'm 5'4".) The epidural I had felt like lightening bolts down my legs, ad after I got over the initial shock of it all, I had no pain relief. The facet-joint injections are the best.

My chiropractor gave me a 2" wide belt that goes around my hips to hold the hip bones in alignment with my spine. It's a really simple device, but I always wear it when lifting something heavy because my hip bone separating slightly from my spine seems to be one big issue with me. As far as wearing any type of heavy back brace, I have been advised against it because it tends to do the work your muscles should be doing and in the end weakens your spine.

My recent and most serious injury yet, a ruptured disk where fluid from inside it leaked into the space between the backbone and the spinal cord, has been tough to solve. It hurt like all get-out when it happened but now there is no pain but I have lost a lot of feeling and control in my right foot, the S1 nerve is being impinged (squished) by the 'goo.' I am having facet joint injections to attempt to bring down the swelling of the nerve caused by this irritation so that the more signal can get through (Wireless, anyone?) and they may eventually have to shave away some bone from inside to make more room there. I, too, am waiting as long as possible. Every technology only gets better the longer you wait, right?

I wanted to tell you something very interesting I just found out. Serotonin levels are related to how you feel pain. Since my most recent injury, even though it doesn't cause pain, my migraines have skyrocketed. I found out that's why they use pain medicines like Lyrica and Cymbalta with anti-depressants. I think it's kinda like how much combined pain your body can take care of before it 'floods' and you feel it intensely because you don't have enough serotonin to suppress it. Not quite sure I understand it all, but might want to ask your neurologist about this.

Just to be clear, my chair is a simple dining room type chair with a 16" x 16" plywood seat covered with 1/2" foam rubber and smooth fabric so I can 'wiggle' and change position easily. I ditched the form-fitted chair with the wheels a long time ago. It held me in the same position too long and hurt.

RE injections:
I just saw a health report* which discussed ozone injections into disc pulp which seem to be effective in 3 out 4 patients with disc extrusions causing nerve impingement. The procedure is apparently now being tested in the USA, but it is used elsewhere in the world.

* CTV News (ctv.ca); Avis Favaro, reporter.

Thanks!

Here's the link:

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/help-for-herniated-discs-doctors-testing-new-ozone-treatment-1.1923326

I'm going to show this to my doctor, that is exactly what happened to me.

I spent a lot of time researching last fall. I have a Steelcase Amia, a step down from their popular, more expensive Leap. One problem is that the lumbar bar (a horizontal bar that slides vertically at the back of the chair) doesn't slide down low enough for me. It seems built for taller people. I don't see what the big deal is about this chair. The cushion isn't even that comfortable and I get hot sitting in it. $600. Why? It's plastic.
Good idea.

I've been treated for major depressive disease (treatment-resistant) and anxiety for 15 years. I've been on Cymbalta for about six years. Cymbalta does act as a pain reliever in addition to its anti-depressant effect. Sometimes it's used for fibromyalgia. I don't know why doctors are still prescribing Effexor, an older, similar drug when Cymbalta, a newer, cleaner drug exists.

You're right that depression (rooted in part in low serotonin levels) will adversely affect your health in various ways, given that depression itself is a physical disease like any other. There's interplay between physical and mental. All or most pain is physical. It's biology and chemistry, not metaphysics.

Anxiety will also severely harm your health. Problem is, like depression, it isn't something you can control by will. You can take Librium or Xanax for anxiety, or Robaxin for a muscle relaxant, like I do, in addition to all the other things doctors recommend for depression and anxiety. But these are treatments, not cures.

I can't take Prednisone, a steroid used for all kinds of things. Years ago my vet gave it to my terrier for itchy skin rashes. I was given it for depression. I sank like a stone. My mom had the same reaction. So I made a point of telling my neurosurgeon this.

All my life I have had trouble relaxing. As soon I as start working on something, no matter what it is, as soon as I concentrate, I tense my shoulders, back, and other muscles: driving, mowing, reading, working, writing. I'm not sure I can make a grocery list without tensing up. Even when I stand I tighten my back, buttocks, and legs. Seriously. It isn't that I'm always nervous, though I can be anxious. It's just a long habit. I have to remind myself to lower my shoulders, for example, when I'm driving. All while trying to maintain good posture, which I have had to learn, rather than my usual slouch.

I grind my teeth at night (TMJ) and so wear a mouthpiece. My jaw muscles are overgrown and as strong as a terrier's. Think of how that kind of pain, or tension, can extend from the jaw, down the neck and back to the waist, muscles and nerves intertwining. Here, too, depression and anxiety likely are a factor. All of these things contribute to pain, and not all pain shows up on x-rays, CAT scans, or MRIs. Reading an MRI, for example, is a surprisingly subjective matter.

I think of all the people out there at work, sitting all day, probably in uncomfortable chairs, working and living under impossible, merciless pressure. No wonder back pain is an epidemic. Maybe we all ought to think about working less. A four-day work week, or a daily siesta. A fantasy of mine that will no doubt come to nothing.

I thought computers were supposed to make life easier.

Deniro,

I'm really sorry that all of this is happening to you. You are right, there are no 'cures' for mood disorders right now, and 'treatments' are not therapeutic, they just help you cope. Much of the newer research points towards neuro transmitters rather than chemical transmitters as causes and I know people who have had 'depression' for years and their lives turned around when they were put on Attention Deficit Disorder medication. New treatments for Parkinsons have been helpful for people with depression. There are some breakthroughs happening right now, it's just taking time. If you live near a research hospital, I suggest you check their website for studies they are doing. And do seek out new opinions from doctors who have not seen you before.

Wise counsel.

BTW, Grelber, I mentioned the article to my neurologist and he had not heard about the ozone injections, but he is going to look into it for me. I am very appreciative.

No lumberjack jokes here, but the article states:

"The vast majority of herniated discs occur in the lower backs of older Canadians, either because of muscle strain injuries or simply through general wear and tear."

Thanks,
Slo

From what I can tell, the trial is still accepting patients/subjects. Perhaps you qualify. It's certainly worth a look-see.

Safety and Effectiveness Study of the AO-1000 Device to Treat Contained Herniated Discs

For complete details see http://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT01339377

Thanks! Just sent them an email. They do say 'contained' and I'm not sure I qualify for that because the disk was ruptured and I'm not sure if it is considered contained four months later. But hey, let them say no.

I may have to join you above the 49th. No US trials.

Sorry to hear that. US residents are not explicitly excluded under Exclusion Criteria.
It makes one wonder why the clinical trials are registered in the USA. Maybe it's an FDA requirement.

Grelber,

I did follow through with the company and am ineligible because I am not within the distance limits of this particular study; the closest is in Vancouver. I will continue to pursue this option and am asking my doctors here to research it. The surgeon reviewed my MRI with me today and it does seem to be my best option. I had some massage/body work done Sunday and it temporarily resolved the problem almost completely, so it is not as complex as I at first believed, and my body can reset itself once everything is right. Muscles that had not been working began to work and ones overworked in their place, like my ankles, ached. It was incredible. Of course, everything crashed when I had to sit for two hours, but I know once the alignment is fixed, my body can, at least for now, fix the problems created pretty neatly.

I'm delighted that you're homing in on a "fix". Stick with it.

I've been dealing with a bad back since 1991. Massage, esp. myofascial release and zero balancing, has been the most helpful for me. Keep at it.

I had completely forgotten about this, and I don't even know if it's pertinent here, but some years back I heard about an Israeli company that was working on a "jack-like" mechanism that could be inserted between two discs, and slowly expanded electronically to restore disc separation and back functionality.

I couldn't locate that project, but my searching did turn up Israeli Company's Futuristic Back Implant Can Repair Damaged Spines, which sounds promising, even if it's not applicable here.

Well, I'm getting something called M.I.L.D. done for my back.

http://swarminteractive.com/patient-education/viewmedica-web.html

Seems to be the best choice. I'll see if it gets some feeling back to my foot. My ankle is falling apart and I am now at 6 months from the injury and in danger of damaging the S1 permanently.

For anyone keeping up, I returned to the surgeon last week after a severe increase in pain. The situation since my first MRI last fall changed dramatically. No one seems to know why.

The degeneration widened. On the scan you can see a hole where (white on scan) cartilage should be between two spinal bones. I got my own CD copy of the scan. Nice.

Surgery not long down the road. Should be able to walk next day, drive after two weeks. Two titanium screws will be inserted between the bones that have been pushing into nerves. No more metal detectors for me.

Must sound odd when people hear I'm happy to go to the hospital. Anything's better than this. Finally the pain is going away.

Edit: I found a link to older versions of Osiris (freeware) which reads MRIs:

Osiris Viewer (older versions)

That's great. Good for you.

I think I speak for everyone in wishing you well.

Thanks for the link to view MRI discs. I have been bringing the discs with me to each doctor but not been able to look at them myself. Funny, something happened between my two MRIs taken three months apart, something very subtle, that luckily a surgeon picked up on. The surgery I had decided on would not have helped me, but I know exactly what you mean by this:

Deniro,

Link to older OsiriX versions doesn't work. Website I found says OsiriX Lite will work, but it won't let me install. Do you know of something for 10.6.8?

Try the direct download URL http://www.osirix-viewer.com/OldVersions/OsiriX4.1.2.pkg.zip, which AFAICT is for the last version running on Snow Leopard. If necessary you can download other versions (except 5.x and 6.x) by substituting the version number components (in the case above 4.1.2) with others pulled from this version page.

While you’re at it, you may also want to look into Joël Spaltenstein’s UnImportantNotice plugin, which supposedly removes the watermarks OsiriX puts on image renditions of the free versions.

Thanks for the link, Alternaut.
I tried a few others in the meantime. None worked and I want to uninstall them and they came without uninstallers so I guess it's a name search, etc.

When the doctors viewed the back MRIs, they had very big screens but I was not able to enlarge any of the views, using OsiriX 4.1.2 where it was really viewable on my 13" laptop.

btw: There were no watermarks with this version.

(Cute dog, Deniro.)

Thanks. That's Barney.

Well, I'm going to need a micro discectomy after all. Monday morning. How did everything go for you, Deniro?

Best of luck!

Hope to never hear you complain again.

I have never been fortunate enough that a micro discectomy could be used, but and hopefully yours will be as successful as my discectomys have been. What I remember most of all is waking up in the recovery room and realizing something was very different. It took a while to realize the difference was freedom from pain. That was and still is a wonderful difference.

Methinks not.

Really happy to hear all went well with you, Deniro.

I had surgery in November. The experience wasn't what I expected due in part to my neurosurgeon's expectations and perhaps to my optimism or misunderstanding.

The sciatica pain in the left leg is gone. What a relief. Some lower back pain remains but it's improving. Overall, I'm quite happy with the result, happy with my surgeon's skill and personality, and I hope for further improvement. My neurosurgeon told me we are on a six-month project. I continue in physical therapy.

What I didn't expect: Four days in the hospital was a nightmare. This is a good hospital, too. My Dad went in two years ago for prostate cancer, my sister five years ago for uterine cancer. Both healthy now.

I won't go into the details because there's too much to say. Suffice it to say, contrary to what my neurosurgeon said, I was unable to walk on my own the next day after the surgery or sit in a chair, nor was I able to drive within a week as he predicted. More like six weeks. The day after surgery, and for my duration there, I needed help to walk even the short way to the bathroom, and walking and even sitting or getting back into bed was excruciating. I had thought foolishly that my time at the hospital would consist of quiet recovery and watching TV.

The surgeon came to see me every morning. He told me that the operation was more involved than he thought. Four hours under. Disc had nearly degenerated to nothing, so there wasn't much to remove. He put two titanium screws connecting two spinal bones. Success.

If you are ever in the hospital, I strongly advise you to have someone with you throughout the whole process, including the pre-testing, doctor visits, MRIs, and all the voluminous paperwork. I'm not sure, but I think I signed my body to Google.

My sister stayed with me every night through the night—one person was allowed. I had trouble keeping track of the days. No clock in my room, no windows, hot, loud, busy with people coming in and out all the time. I found the staff in my room to be young, inexperienced, immature, overworked, and lacking in compassion. They weren't bad people. They just didn't seem professional or confident.

The time at home following the surgery was tough, painfull mentally and physically. Fortunately I had a lot of help.

> ...people coming in and out all the time.

Did you have to spell your name for every doctor, nurse, and orderly who walked into your room?

I found that infuriating when I had my arthritis surgery last year, particularly because nobody could explain why they were asking me to do it.

I can imagine any number of patients with high blood pressure dying of strokes before they ever get to the operating room because of spelling-related anxiety.

Sorry for forgetting to say that I'm happy to hear that you got at least some immediate relief from your surgery, and that I hope your progress is stunningly good.

might have been a check on your mental state.

I asked that exact question..no joy.

Well, my surgery is over, a little more pain now than I thought would be, sorry Artie. Still waiting to see if I get feeling back in my foot.

Does anybody ever dance joyously out of the hospital as they expected to do when they went in?

Just take it easy and feel better, and lots of luck!

Yes, at least sometimes.
A couple weeks ago I experienced a "cardiac incident" (something less than a full-fledged heart attack) which produced damage reversible by cardiac R&R (primarily via an ACE inhibitor for a month).
In the diagnostic process an angiogram found that my coronary arteries are in pristine condition. Moreover, my cholesterol panel puts me at a lower than average risk for coronary heart disease/attack over the next 10 years.
(Given my cholesterol-oblivious diet [and probably genes], my deep and scientifically defensible disdain for "killer" statins has been vindicated.)
That's all information I would never have acquired otherwise.
So, yes, I danced out of the hospital joyously and am now back to jogging with aplomb.

As for the annoyance of staff asking for you to spell your name:
For safety's sake (for you and the asker) it provides another check on your identity so that you don't wind up with the wrong meds or the wrong procedures. Annoying, but win-win.

Good for you! (But I really meant after a procedure.)


In that case, I'd think that simply asking me what my name was would have sufficed. (Even if they were actually worried that I slipped a ringer into my bed while they weren't looking, he could have been well prepared.)

But more to the point... Not one single solitary person gave me an acceptable reason when I asked "Why?"

They could have just looked at my wristband, fer cryin' out loud!

I thought it was great that they asked and asked and they asked and asked what I was having done and the surgeon marked the left side of my back and where the cut was going to be made when he spoke to me before the surgery. All these things were concerns. Many things go wrong.

Cardiac catheterization is definitely a procedure (and one not without its risks, especially while being treated with anticoagulants).

In the second case, I would imagine that every institution has its own protocols to continually ID patients. Some will ask names and/or birth dates, others might wish to assess awareness; spelling one's name requires multiple abilities and can be a sensitive (albeit annoying) test, illuminating mental status. Even when getting blood work done, one is asked for name and birth date prior to getting jabbed, just to eliminate error.

If no one could answer why they were doing that, recourse to the ward/service supervisor or manager or to the hospital's patient advocate is always an option. I've always found that "rattling cages" gets results in fairly short order.

I didn't dance before or after I left. I was in pain both times. In fact, when I left I was in more pain than when I went in. But of course that's a misleading statement. I did get better with time.

Whenever something had to be done to me, I was asked my birthday. I must have answered that question 50 times. I assumed it was a security question. Is it really all that secure a question? Anyone can find out my birthday. At this point in time, probably anyone can find out anything about me, including my medical records, despite all attempts to keep the lid sealed. What was really annoying was they often interrupted my sleep, and I slept a lot. They expected me to be immediately responsive, articulate, and lucid. I just wanted them to go away so I could get back to sleep.

I don't remember anybody asking what my procedure was to be, but I was pleased by the surgeon's autographing the finger that was to be fused.

On the other hand...well, I'd almost have preferred that she operate on the other hand and improve the quality of my retirement...wouldn't have been much of a hardship at all.

Seriously, though, with all the wacky stuff you hear about, I guess it's hard to fault a hospital for positive overkill.

Of course, but you didn't dance out of the hospital as a result of your procedure; you left happy because of coincidental good news.

The only reason I could think of for their asking me to spell my name repeatedly was to check on my state of mind, but they said "Nope, yadda, yadda...double-talk."

If they were actually worried that the person wearing my bracelet wasn't me, then I maybe need to rethink my opinion of Hospital For Special Surgery!

In the end, though, you're right... I should have made some noise.

Welcome to modern medicine! Being in a hospital is not fun even in the best of circumstances.

I am married to a hospital chaplain, our son is a Radiologist and I was hospitalized three times last year for three different reasons so I am quite familiar with the drill. According to my son, who spends 10 hours a day reading MRIs, CT scans, etc. there is only so much detail that can be discerned even with the best technology, equipment, and training. In an area such as the spine it is not that unusual to find different conditions, worse or better, than can be seen in the radiological studies. My last cervical fusion was scheduled to take two hours and instead it took six and a half because of scaring that did not show in the MRI. The surgeon is like General Eisenhower said of the D-Day landings, "Before the battle careful planning is everything. After that battle starts it is nothing." Surgeons are not omniscient and have to deal with what they find when they actually see what is there once they get in.

Lots of hospital regulations like spelling your name or giving your date of birth to everyone coming into the room can be annoying (I began to think my d.o.b. was my real name), but mistakes do happen in a busy hospital and what is annoyingly repetitious to the patient serves several purposes, it is a double check on whether you are the right patient and how alert you are which gives an indication of your condition. Always having to call for an attendant when you go to the potty after a surgery is a real pain in the nether regions both psychologically and maybe physically, but the effects anesthesia can be tricky. In our litigious culture the doctor, nurse, and hospital will likely be sued should you slip and fall, even if you did so against medical advice, and their insurance will settle and increase the practitioner's already stratospheric insurance premiums until they are forced to leave medicine. It happens far too often.

It has occurred to me there should be a "writer's cramp" warning in the informed consent before hospitalization. What annoys me is going back to the same hospital eight weeks after being released and having to fill out all the same forms and sign all the same releases and the admissions clerk verifying what you filled out by comparing it to your data that is already in their computer! My wife had a procedure at a hospital where she had to fill out the same forms and sign the same releases in every department! and she was seen in five different departments. Apparently their departmental patient registration systems do not talk to one another. Before computerization you could simply take a photocopy of the information and drop it off at each department.

Anyway, glad you are home and doing better.

I hope you're doing well and your problems are abating.

I didn't really follow the conversation, but I think you may find Image32 ($24/year) useful. (Runs in Snowy)


Hope this helps.

Artie,

Thanks for asking. My right foot is feeling less like it is stuck in a bucket of ice. Let's say it is defrosting, I feel little electrical shocks and a lot of something that feels like tiny rivers flowing. And since the surgeon freed up the compressed S1 on the left, there were a whole lot of things that were happening on the left side I was unaware of and I mean that in a bad way.

It seems very hopeful right now.

Slo

Exactly what should be happening as things get back to 'normal'. Enjoy that part of the experience; it can be quite entertaining, if not exhilarating.

Sounds promising, Slo; best ongoing luck!