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Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
#20555 02/07/12 08:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2009
JoBoy Offline OP
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I posted this question on the Apple Forum yesterday hoping one of the geniuses would see it and reply, but so far nothing. I sent it to Apple from my wife's iMac using Firefox 6.0.1 for reasons explained below. I'm sending this message to FineTunedMac using Safari on my MacPro which is not involved with this problem. Will you good people here please give this one a try?

This problem involves my wife's Intel i7 iMac11,1 with a 27" screen. She started having problems with her email app (Entourage). I was unable to fix it. I finally recommended that we restore a previous incarnation of the MacOS 10.6.8 by restoring from Time Machine to the main hard drive. She agreed and I went to work. After Restore had finished, I tried to open several apps without success. I then used Disk Warrior 4.3 to update the iMac by booting the DVD on my Mac Pro and putting the iMac in Target Disk Mode since the iMac can't boot DW 4.3, but 4.3 can be used via Firewire to create a new directory. The non-Apple apps seemed to run fine after that, but I still couldn't get some Apple apps to open. They would suddenly quit while they were in the process of opening. I then used the Apple Application Install DVD that came with the iMac to install the Apple Apps with the hope that the Apple Apps would open correctly and then I could update them from Apple Downloads or Software Update. When the install disk finished installing Apple Apps, I tried to open Safari to go the Apple Downloads, but Safari still quit suddenly during my attempt to open it. In desperation, I opened Firefox 6.0.1 and went to Apple Downloads. There, I downloaded Mac OS X 10.6.8 Update Combo v 1.1 followed by a security update that ended with the number 1. After restart, I found that Font Book and DVD Player and iDVD and Garage Band and Quick Time Player 10.0 and iCal and Image Capture and iMovie and Calculator and Automator and Address Book and the Mail app and Preview and System Preferences and Text Edit and Grab app and Terminal opened without quitting, but Safari and Dictionary and iPhoto and Dashboard and App Store and iTunes still quit suddenly when I tried to open them. I didn't try the remaining Apple apps. I tested some non-Apple apps. VMware Fusion and Google Earth and MacScan all opened without quitting.

There are four events that may shed additional light. The backup power source went flaky a couple of days ago and it went on and off battery power rapidly until I unplugged it. Second, a power strip for my wife's iMac has since been plugged directly into the house current with no backup battery. Third, yesterday, the room became quite warm and the back side of the iMac became very warm or hot, but not hot enough to burn skin. Fourth, my wife insists on storing many of her files on the desktop. The desktop is virtually full of icons. I took a bunch of folders that she had on the desktop and put them in a folder in Documents, but there a quite a few folders still on the desktop and I estimate they will more than fill the screen if the files in them were all moved out of the folders and on to the desktop. It's handy and she can work faster than looking for them in Documents. Is it possible that power bumps from the house current or from the flaky backup battery could have damaged hardware or could such events damage software that is not replaced by the Restore from Time Machine? Could overheating damage hardware or software that is not replaced by Restore or the 10.6.8 Combo Update? Could too many files and folders cause the problems I'm having? She's operated this way for a year without problems, but I think the number of files had gradually increased during that time.

Frankly, I'm stumped. Any comments or help would be greatly appreciated. Your replies will come to the email on my MacPro since that's what I have in my profile. The MacPro is working just fine thank you.

Last edited by JoBoy; 02/07/12 08:54 PM.

Mac Pro dual Quad-Core Intel Xeons Early 2008; 16GB RAM; MacOS X 10.11.6, iOS 9.3.5
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20556 02/07/12 11:36 PM
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Have you run SMART and/or a surface scan to see if the hard drive shows any signs of damage? What is the capacity of the hard drive and how much free space does it have? Does the problem occur if she logs into a test account?

This may be premature, but you could try to Archive & Install rather than use Time Machine.

Last edited by jchuzi; 02/07/12 11:36 PM.

Jon

macOS 11.7.10, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P600, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20557 02/07/12 11:47 PM
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> Could too many files and folders cause the problems I'm having?

Too many files/folders on a desktop can cause startup and other issues, but I don't know whether your wife's desktop is at the root of hers.

It would be a useful and not terribly difficult exercise, though, to reduce the desktop to a handful of folders to see what happens. Even if it doesn't resolve her issues, your wife may find that it helps her Mac's overall performance in other ways.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
artie505 #20559 02/08/12 01:26 AM
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Jon & Artie:

Thanks for the suggestions. Right after I sent the first message on this topic, we started migrating her desktop to a group of folders we set up in Documents that make sense to her. We also began backing them off to DVDs. Get this: She had 14 GB of stuff on her desktop. I had no idea it was that much. The hard drive is 1TB with over 800GB available. Time Machine is on an external drive that is also 1TB. We're still in the process of moving files and folders and backing to DVDs. When we get done, we'll see if it did any good. Then we'll start in on your suggestions. Thanks a lot for the assist. If I'd known how much she had on that desktop, I would have worked on that before raising all the other questions in my post. I'm still shaking my head. smile


Mac Pro dual Quad-Core Intel Xeons Early 2008; 16GB RAM; MacOS X 10.11.6, iOS 9.3.5
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20572 02/09/12 09:28 AM
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> [...] we started migrating her desktop to a group of folders we set up in Documents that make sense to her.

Have you considered "stacks?"

Originally Posted By: Mac Help
Stacks

Folders in the Dock can be viewed as “stacks.” A stack can be a handful of documents, a group of applications, or a set of folders—anything you need to use frequently. When you click a stack, it springs open in an arc or a grid, depending on the number of items it contains. You can drag items in and out of stacks, just as you do with folders.

The Dock comes with three stacks already in place:

Applications, the folder that holds most of the applications on your Mac

Downloads, where items you download from the Internet are stored

Documents, the default location for new documents you create

You can add more stacks by dragging folders to the Dock. You can create as many stacks as you like.

If you prefer to view a stack as a folder, press the stack’s icon in the Dock and choose “Display as Folder.”


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20573 02/09/12 02:49 PM
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> Get this: She had 14 GB of stuff on her desktop. I had no idea it was that much.

By the way... I don't think the amount of data on your wife's desktop is as important a factor as the number of files and folders, i.e. the number of icons Finder has to deal with.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
artie505 #20574 02/09/12 05:22 PM
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Thanks a lot for the tips. The icons literally covered a 27" screen. Now the screen only contains the boot drive's icon. After doing that, I used the iMac's original install disk to use Disk Utility to repair disk and repair permissions and then used Disk Warrior 4.3 via Firewire from my Mac Pro to check the iMac's S.M.A.R.T. check, to examine the files and folders for folder depth and file damage and to rebuild the directory again. No abnormalities were noted except a couple of damaged .rsrc files in Microsoft AutoUpdate (we use MS Office 2008) that I deleted. I backed up really important folders to 12 DVDs. I'm now taking the machine to the Apple Store where they have better diagnostic equipment and a lot of experience that I don't have. I've spent 2.5 days on this and I can't afford any more. Thanks a lot for your interest and help.


Mac Pro dual Quad-Core Intel Xeons Early 2008; 16GB RAM; MacOS X 10.11.6, iOS 9.3.5
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20575 02/09/12 07:22 PM
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Be sure to let us know the outcome of the trip to the Apple Store.


On a Mac since 1984.
Currently: 24" M1 iMac, M2 Pro Mac mini with 27" BenQ monitor, M2 Macbook Air, MacOS 14.x; iPhones, iPods (yes, still) and iPads.
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
Ira L #20577 02/10/12 12:04 AM
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Here's the report. The trip to the Apple Store's Genius Bar was somewhere between extremely good fortune and a miracle. First, I'll mention that the help that is given at the Genius Bar is free for all advice and software issues. Applecare is needed to cover the cost of replacement parts if needed. I still have coverage so I wasn't worried, but I found it interesting that the advice and software issues were free.

Now for the miracle: I hauled the iMac into the store and put it on the counter just a little late for the appointed time. Luckily, there was not a long line. I gave the fellow who waited on me a written history of what I had done to try to fix the problem. After reading it, he said, "This is really interesting. I had this same problem with my personal iMac at home last week. It took me a long time to figure it out, but I know exactly what to do." With that intro, he checked to make sure that the problem really was what I had represented to him. Then, he dialed up Apple on the Internet to a place I can't go. He downloaded a bunch of installation applications and selected the one for OSX 10.6.8 which is the one I use. He installed it without affecting any of the data or non-Apple applications and then began testing it. Every application, Apple or not, opened normally. The problem was solved. At that point, I started to whine a little. I said I'd lost enough billable time over this issue to have bought a new iMac. I had installed a new system from the installation disk for 10.6 that came with the iMac and then updated it using the 10.6.8 Combo update from Apple Downloads, but it didn't fix the problem. He then explained that there is something that doesn't quite work to fix that problem using the method I used, but, when he gets 10.6.8 directly from Apple in one piece, the problem is fixed. I shook my head and thanked him profusely and hauled the iMac back to the car. Needless to say, I'm a very happy camper. Thanks for your interest. This was a really unusual problem, but I was fortunate to find the right Genius for the job.

Last edited by JoBoy; 02/10/12 12:09 AM.

Mac Pro dual Quad-Core Intel Xeons Early 2008; 16GB RAM; MacOS X 10.11.6, iOS 9.3.5
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20579 02/10/12 12:19 AM
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Great news!

But I'd love to know the reason for

Originally Posted By: Genius
He then explained that there is something that doesn't quite work to fix that problem using the method I used, but, when he gets 10.6.8 directly from Apple in one piece, the problem is fixed.

confused

(Precisely what method did you use?)


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
artie505 #20580 02/10/12 12:35 AM
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The method I used was to get out the install disk that came with the iMac. I installed the system, but didn't mess with the data or non-Apple applications. Then, I went to Apple Downloads and downloaded the 10.6.8 Combo system update. That is supposed to do the job, but, in this particular situation, it doesn't. I have no idea why. You'd think that what I did was the equivalent of a complete 10.6.8, but it apparently isn't quite the same. He did not explain it any more than what I have written here. My guess is that Apple has 10.6.8 available in "one piece" but that's not generally available because it represents a complete operating system "for free." However, in this situation, they'll replace it at a Genius Bar to repair the system I already paid for. I didn't ask if I could buy a 10.6.8 system disk. All I really know is that I had a very tough problem and it is now fixed. For that, I'm grateful. Due to the line that was forming behind me, we did not discuss the possible causes of the problem.


Mac Pro dual Quad-Core Intel Xeons Early 2008; 16GB RAM; MacOS X 10.11.6, iOS 9.3.5
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20583 02/10/12 05:44 AM
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> You'd think that what I did was the equivalent of a complete 10.6.8, but it apparently isn't quite the same.

You would think so , wouldn't you, which leaves me curious about what actually happened. (It's not as if your wife's issues arose immediately after she updated to 10.6.8.)

It seems like there ought to be an Apple kBase doc or some-such on the subject, but I looked and didn't find anything.


The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
JoBoy #20584 02/10/12 07:19 AM
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> I didn't ask if I could buy a 10.6.8 system disk.

The Apple Store is selling Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard v 10.6.3...presumably the most advanced version released in disc form.

Last edited by artie505; 02/10/12 07:23 AM. Reason: Rewrite

The new Great Equalizer is the SEND button.

In Memory of Harv: Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~Voltaire
Re: Safari and other Mac apps quit upon opening
artie505 #20591 02/10/12 05:04 PM
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This experience was off the charts for me. I had no reason to suspect what the real problem turned out to be. I regret that the circumstances prevented my discussing the probable cause of the problem, but I'm so happy to be back in business I can't worry too much about it. However, if the same symptoms happen again, I'll go straight to the Apple Store and not mess around for three days trying to fix it. I really appreciate your making an effort to figure it out. Unfortunately, we didn't have the facts available to the Genius. The fix turned out to be as miraculous and the onset was mysterious.


Mac Pro dual Quad-Core Intel Xeons Early 2008; 16GB RAM; MacOS X 10.11.6, iOS 9.3.5

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